Classification of different sects.

Discussion in 'General Topics' started by ridawi, May 20, 2016.

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  1. ridawi

    ridawi Muhammadi Sunni Hanafi

    According to the fuqaha, however, it is disbelief to deny the caliphate of the shaykhayn (Abu Bakr and Umar).
     
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  2. sunni_porter

    sunni_porter Well-Known Member

    On a side note, Dr. Shadee references Nuh Keller's article Iman, Kufr and Takfir in a recent post here. Someone should forward him a copy of The Killer Mistake.
     
  3. Exposition

    Exposition Active Member


    Aside from the necessities [darūriyāt], to deny any aspect (of the religion) is not disbelief [kufr]: even if it be proven explicitly. For according to sound research, a man does not leave Islam except by denying that which brought him into the fold of Islam: and that was naught but the neccesities of the religion [darūriyāt al-dīn]. Thus the one who denies the caliphate of the rightly-guided caliphs is not a disbeliever in the school of sound research. This in spite of this reality being known with certainty from explicit sources.
     
  4. Musafir

    Musafir Active Member

    A person denies a Qat'i (in transmission and meaning) which hasnt reached the level of Necessary Knowledge (known to scholars and laypeople alike) and even after that person has been shown that it is Qat'i (in transmission and meaning) and the proofs are established before that person and he still rejects it how can he possibly remain Muslim?
     
  5. Noori

    Noori Senior Moderator

    it is simple, according to Al-Mu'taqad al-Muntaqad there are three categories of deviants, i explain it in my own words;

    1) those who hold beliefs which are categorized as bid'ah mukaffirah, i.e their bid'ah has reached the level of kufr, they are kafirs and will remain in hell fire forever. they are called muslims only because of their apparent state, otherwise they do not belong to the ummat al ijabah.

    2) those who hold beliefs or do actions which have not reached the level of kufr, yet it is bid'ah sayyiah, they are not kafir but deviant (yet considered muslims) according to the severity of their bid'ah. they will enter jannah after or without punishment, again depending on the severity of their bid'ah, and only with Allah's mercy because they did not deny the fundamentals of the religion.

    3) those who are deviants only due to association, they too are deviants but their bid'ah is milder, they are sinners and they too will enter jannah with or without punishment, but the sharai hukm upon them is milder than the 2nd category.

    note that if any deviant in the later two categories supports or defends the heresies of the first category then he will be among them.

    edited: Al-Mu'taqad al-Muntaqad (also here) is the book by Allamah Fadl al-Rasul al-Badayuni and Al-Mustanad al-Mu'tamad is the hashiyah by Ala Hazrat alihhima rahmah wa riDhwan
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2016
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  6. FaqirHaider

    FaqirHaider اللَه المقدر والعالم شؤون لا تكثر لهمك ما قدر يكون

    those 72 will eventually enter heaven.
     
  7. Adham12

    Adham12 Active Member

    So when Dr Shadee is referring to the 72 sects, is he referring to the ones in this hadith that are destined for hell fire?

    'Awf ibn Malik reported that the Prophet (Peace be upon him) said, The Jews split into 71 sects: one will enter Paradise and 70 will enter Hell. The Christians split into 72 sects: 71 will enter Hell and one will enter Paradise. By Him in Whose hand is my soul, my Ummah will split into 73 sects: one will enter Paradise and 72 will enter Hell...' (Tirmidhi, vol. 2, pg. 89)
     
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  8. FaqirHaider

    FaqirHaider اللَه المقدر والعالم شؤون لا تكثر لهمك ما قدر يكون

    yes like the zaidi shia they are heretics but we would not call them kafir, or murtad unlike the isna ashari or ismaeelis.
     
  9. Adham12

    Adham12 Active Member

    Asalmalykum,



    In the above video starting 31.12, Dr Shadee explains the second category of heresy in which he explains if a person were to reject, after been shown evidence, of an aspect of Islam such as the physical ascension of Muhammad Mustafa sallahu alayhe wasalm during Isra and Mi'raj, then that person is a heretic, but still a Muslim. Dr Shadee states this is how the different sects form. He states this around 32.15

    I'm confused about that statement. Even though someone may be a heretic, they can still be considered part of this Ummah, a Muslim, and still be part of one of the 72 sects at the same time?
     

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