Amazing: Shaykh Tahir al Qadri challenge: Ask! I will SHOW you whatever you want!

Discussion in 'Multimedia' started by Wadood, May 14, 2008.

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  1. Wadood

    Wadood Veteran

    And to add some more; among the most evil, dirty, and oppressive politics in Pakistan is played none other by the open liars the rafiDis. They have private militias funded by Iran and extremely rich people in Pakistan and abroad.

    I am making this another topic for relevancy. Please look at "the rafiDis of Punjab"
     
  2. Wadood

    Wadood Veteran

    On the topic of politics, the point that I was making has been slightly misunderstood and taken a slightly different way than I was heading towards.

    Let me make it clear: the upper-middle-class/middle-class/rich Sunnis who I met in Lahore told me to keep away from Minhaj ul-Qur'an because it engages not in politics but in "dirty-politics". They told me that Minhaj ul-Qur'an brainwashed innocent people to make use of them for political purposes (as suicide bombers?that was the attitude I felt talking to them). This is different than saying that Minhaj ul-Qur'an is a righteous Sunni political group.

    This is a serious accusation against Minhaj ul-Qur'an. And I think these people were few in number and were kind of exagerrating because on the ground I do not see as such personally. However, that is why I felt that it would be better for Minhaj ul-Qur'an to declare itself free from the evil politics in Pakistan.

    But then the point made by Chishti is so true no honest Sunni Muslim can disagree. What do we do about this country Pakistan? The wahabi/deobandits have no hesitation to join the evil politics in Pakistan and dominate its religious affairs if the Sunni political groups bail out of fear of the "evil" politics I am alluding towards.
     
  3. CHISHTI

    CHISHTI Well-Known Member

    Comprehension of the english language has never been a problem for me but feel free to take the gmat test if you like.

    KN came on here and used undeniably bad adab when talking about the Holy Qur'an, the Sahaaba, orthodox Muslim scholars and tried to ignite warfare over the legality of intoxicants....but i suspect his skill in the Arabic language entertained you and your nafs enjoyed a joust with this man so he is "welcome back on this forum" whereas others have been shot down by you over minor issues and made to feel low by your arrogant put downs.

    Your refutation was luke warm, as you obviously enjoyed his company, but red hot when confronted with a casual remark made by regular contributors to this site.

    When he praised people such as nazzam and ibn sina you said nothing but if someone mentioned gangohi or thanwi then suddenly you would have become the defender of Sunniyat and blown them away.

    When KN said he was leaving because he wasn't "growing" i guess he meant that your posts never made an impact on him and his questions weren't answered by you - the resident scholar - so please don't impune me with a lack of intellect...maybe your lack of study didn't quite hit KN's high mark.

    As this banter is obviously of no real importance i shall cease to post on this subject and i will take my leave.
     
  4. Do they have an arrogance section in the questionairre?
     
  5. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    there you go again. i do not agree with kN's position and have refuted him already but that does not mean we should twist his post and attribute things to him that he did not say. in this line you make the same mistake: make it appear as if i am justifying kN's mistakes!

    i think they should make gmat tests for comprehension and reasoning mandatory for those who want to participate in a discussion.
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2008
  6. CHISHTI

    CHISHTI Well-Known Member

    "you are just imputing meanings to my post like you did with kN earlier without properly reading what he said."....Fine brother...you continue with the missunderstood genius that is KN and i'll stick the "mistakes" of Prof.Sahib and see who benefits.
     
  7. faqir

    faqir Veteran

    as-salamu `alaikum
    Brother, please read what the salaf and sahaba said about this!
    I don't want to create and intra scholar war but do see what sh. gibril said also:

    I personally gain alot from Sh. tahir al-qadri's lectures but i'm sorry I don't see how one can justify this - even if he really is 'shaykh al-islam'.

    I would just like to give some advice sidi even though I am in no place to give you or anyone any advice... lets not speak about such issues as though we are some authority and without any backup from any shuyukh as we could inadvertently make a big mistake of playing with the shari'ah and appearing to permit the haram or something even worse.
     
  8. I think i'll be asking the Gen secretary of minhajul Quran uk(who im in regular contact with) to see what excuse Dr Sahib gives for this,its a very controversial issue these days and a knife in the hands of not just najdis but a small group of sunnis too.

    See if he can clarify.
     
  9. Yaseen

    Yaseen Active Member

    Surely somebody of Profs status is aware xmas and it's historical background. Also this has been going on for a few years and surely they are aware re this being controversial as in my opinion all it does is serve the najdi's cause further. Prof has done great work for the Sunni cause but the najdiya have had a field day with some of his actions as is evident on utube.
     
  10. Ah! The Shirk Brigade has arrived I see!

    Christmas: Celebrating the birth of Isa alayhisalatuwasalam. What's wrong with celebrating the birth of a great Prophet of Allah? Just cos Xtians do something doesn't mean Muslims automatically cannot do it!

    Having said that I do not think it was wise of Prof. Sahib to do this as it sets a bad precedent and was certainly innovatory--though I think his intention was to show charity to the Christians in pakistan and make them feel part of the community--building bridges etc.

    Certainly wasn't shirk!
     
  11. SA01

    SA01 Veteran

    Uhhhh............remind yourself brother, what is the definition of Shirk!?
     
  12. SA01

    SA01 Veteran

    And they lived happily ever after! Aahhhh.....so sweet!:D
     
  13. apology accepted! :p

    don't do it again or else or you'll get a whupping! [to quote Muhammad Ali!!] -only joking (just to make sure there are no misunderstandings!)

    To quote from The Hulk,
    "Don't make me angry....you won't like me when I'm angry!" (I RARELY get angry...)
     
  14. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    before this spirals into an unnecessary war of words, let me clarify and quit: when i posted the comment, it was meant to correct nj's sweeping statement and i did not mean to sound as ugly as chishti makes it out to be. however, when i now go back and read it, it does look bad.

    so, i will take it back and apologize to nj.

    as for the rest of your comment, you are just imputing meanings to my post like you did with kN earlier without properly reading what he said.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2008
  15. CHISHTI

    CHISHTI Well-Known Member

    You're not an idiot bruth....just a brother who has his opinion about certain issues and posts them....which is the whole point of a forum.
     
  16. thanks for the defense chishti sahib... maybe i AM an idiot! :D

    anyway the 'show' in the speech of professor sahib was not referring to the quran per my understanding. he was talking about awliya and i think his challenge was that if you do not believe in all these things about the awliya which are in the quran ask me and i will show u these things--i.e. karamaat.

    yes i generally HATE the inter-sunni rivalries. it pees me off to be honest. especially when followers of pir X tell you you shouldn't listen to pir Y cos pir X says pir Y isn't a real Sunni and then pir Z's murids come along and tell you actually both of you are wrong only my pir is a real sunni and the rest are deviants!

    we've made a real laughing stock of sunniyat...i bet the deobandits/wobblers/tabbies/shi'tes etc. who lurk at sunniport must be loving it!

    the most ridiculous thing is that some ppl refer to the brothers from minhaj ul qur'an as 'tahiris' and call it the 'tahiri firqa!' let me state i am not in any way affiliated to MuQ but this constant bashing of the shaykh is crazy!
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2008
  17. CHISHTI

    CHISHTI Well-Known Member

    You know brother i'm not a minhaji or a dawate islami or belonging to any of the Sunni jamaats but i respect them all. The work which groups such as dawate islami, minhaj ul Qur'an, sunni dawate islami, world islamic mission etc are doing is great and i hope they continue to progress, i also love the barelwi shayookh, ashrafi shayookh and all Sunni shayookh who work for Deen even if they differ on some points and even make mistakes...as to err is human...but what i can't stand is the political sniping and inter jamaat politics which results in the character assasination of ulema.

    The house of sunniyat is on fire from outside and within and all we can do is argue amongst ourselves about who is more competant to ring the fire brigade!!

    We need different jamaats because we're all different and the approach of one jamaat might not be your cup of tea but the approach of another jamaat might be....what we need is tolerance and mutual understanding.

    I'm not saying that Prof.Sahib hasn't made mistakes but to just continuously re-hash these mistakes in an attempt to disqualify the work he has done since is petty and only shows the prejudice of the perpetrators.

    I'm not asking anyone to love him just agree that he's working hard for Deen internationally and give credit where credit is due and not single him out for critisizm when other famous personalities can be critisized for the same "crime"...as in the sphere of politics which was the original thrust of the thread.
     
  18. Typical young sunni response: Chisti sahib you make a great point, but i'm not allowed to believe you!
     
  19. CHISHTI

    CHISHTI Well-Known Member

    "and you, i suppose, KNOW sunni aqidah inside out."....no brother AH only you know it and all others are donkeys...brother NJ is a respected member of this forum and you constantly insult and badger him...isn't he allowed his opinion or are we to check with you before we post so as not to upset you or go against maslak i abu hasan!



    Yeah Prof. Sahib is a great asset...while our some of our other ulema sit in their own madrasseh in india/pakistan and receive praise only from their own students/mureeds Prof. Sahib has gone around the world...that's the sperichal world not the flat one like some other ulema have said but hey...they can get away with mistakes whereas Prof. Sahib's mistakes have to be highlighted at every opportunity while their mistakes are swept under the rug.....and he has elucidated and defined the belief of Ahle Sunnah to the arab shayookh so they can see who are the Ahle Sunnah in the subcontinent.

    Lets continue to slag him off though and just praise the ulema who we have nisbat with, lets not give credit where credit is due 'cos maybe the rememberance of the ulema we are connected with might drop in the eyes of the awaam.

    Lets just work to further our own personal shayookh or Pir khana at the expense of everything else and deride and abuse all others because they differ from our understanding...cos it's only OUR understanding that counts at the end of the day isn't it?
     

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