Deobandis on citations from Mirqat al-Mafatih

Discussion in 'Refutation' started by Qadiriyyah, Jul 22, 2020.

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  1. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    Umar99, Noori and Aqdas like this.
  2. Unbeknown

    Unbeknown Senior Moderator

    from the preceding context, especially use of the word mu'jiza - it seems that even if the word is ta'ala - it will kill two birds at a time - the mu'tazilah (who denied juz'i knowledge) and the wahabiya/dayabina and their likes who deny unseen knowledge for the Prophet (peace be upon him) - because he (peace be upon him) informed us of the juz'i and kulli *because* Allah ta'ala had informed him of it.

    infact it is even more damning for the dayabina, because, the author didn't even try to stress the point (that he - peace be upon him - was given such knowledge - he took it for granted), instead he stressed that the Knowledge of Allah ta'ala encompasses even the juz'yi.

    as if to say:

    "this shows the miracle of fore-knowledge for the Prophet, and the Perfection of the source of that knowledge - i.e. Allah ta'ala, for how could such a miracle have been possible for the recipient (peace be upon him) if the Bestower (as-SubHan) did not possess it in the first place - as the mu'tazila claimed?!"
     
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  3. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    not unexpected.
    devs might be beside themselves with glee.

    i suppose some zaleel will now be salivating at the prospect of writing a pleonastic post on how barelwis distort hadith blah-blah; yet, i am sure it won't occur to the idiot that the naSS of the hadith itself proves our claim.

    ---
    my post was only to illustrate one method of verifying tampering by our contemporaries - and i also hinted that this should not be considered as the final word on the matter as other MSs could exist. regardless, we have to be honest and in-sha'Allah, we will not be unfair even with our enemies. that was the message.

    ---
    a question arises: what is the guarantee that the sulaymaniye manuscript itself contained the mistake? and then it was copied by other copyists?

    ---
    it is quite possible that there is another version/print, which was available to mufti sahib at that time, and thus he has quoted. in fact, that seems to be more legit because it agrees with other opinions and mulla ali qari's own opinion elsewhere.

    the sentence requires that it should be alayhis salam and not ta'ala because the discussion is about the knowledge of RasulAllah sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam and his mu'jizat (unless devbandi considers that the action of Allah ta'ala can be termed 'mujizah').

    in sha'Allah, we need to look at this a little more closely.

    ----
    Allah ta'ala knows best.
     
  4. Tariq Owaisi

    Tariq Owaisi Active Member

    Apparently some deobandis are accusing Ahmad Yaar Khan Naeemi in Ja Al Haq (vol 10 pg 58) of swapping the reference of Mulla Ali Qari in Sharh Mishkat of Allah's knowledge to that of RasoolAllah's (SallAllaahu alaihi wa sallam)
     
  5. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    i checked two manuscripts. one from KSU (king saud uni) and another from sulaymaniye and they both have "ta'ala". it is quite possible that for an older or a more reliable manuscript - but i could lay my hands on these two (searching on the internet).

    ====
    the sulaymaniye MS is dated as being inscribed in 1161 AH.

    MS-sul1.png

    MS-sul2.png




    MS-sul3.png


    LAST PAGE:

    MS-sul4.png


    on the page marked 442 in this MS:

    MS mirqat, v2,sul, p442.png


    ===
    similarly in MS #4943 of KSU:

    DSC00003.JPG


    IMAGE #150, page marked #247.

    MS-mirq, v2,p247,im150.png


    Allah ta'ala knows best.
     
  6. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    how do you say it is tampered?
     
  7. AR Ahmed

    AR Ahmed Active Member

  8. Qadiriyyah

    Qadiriyyah New Member

    If anyone has a Sunni publication of Mirqat al-Mafatih and could upload a picture of the page with the correct wording in it, I would be really grateful. It's volume 10, page 58.
     
  9. Noori

    Noori Senior Moderator

    here is a deobandi urdu translation
     
  10. Qadiriyyah

    Qadiriyyah New Member

    Not sure if this has been addressed before, alongside the other tampering done with Imam Mulla 'Ali al-Qari's works, but I came across another such example in the Imam's Sharh of Mishkat too.

    The Imam states the Hadith concerning those people who will prepare to make Jihad with Dajjal and that the Messenger صلى الله عليه و سلم states: 'I know their (the Mujahideen) names, their father's names and the colours of their horses'.

    In the commentary of the Hadith, the Imam concludes with:
    فيه مع كونه من المعجزات دلالة على أن علمه عليه السلام محيط بالكليات و الجزئيات من الكائنات و غيرها (also quoted in Ja al-Haq)
    'Besides this Hadith being from the prophetic miracles (Mu'jizat), it also proves that his (The Messenger صلى الله عليه و سلم) knowledge encompasses all Kulli and Juz'i knowledge of the universe'

    Deobandis have changed this to:
    فيه مع كونه من المعجزات دلالة على أن علمه تعالى محيط بالكليات و الجزئيات من الكائنات و غيرها
    'Besides this Hadith being from the prophetic miracles (Mu'jizat), it also proves that the knowledge of Allah Ta'ala encompasses all Kulli and Juz'i knowledge of the universe'

    The change is an embarrassing one to say the least, given how clear it is to notice by looking at the context.

    The above was found in volume 10, Kitab al-Fitan, Bab al-Malahim (in case anyone has a copy that may be published by Deobandis)

    Jazak-Allah Khayr
     
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