Waris Shah

Discussion in 'Siyar an-Nubala' started by saghe_jilani, Sep 25, 2008.

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  1. saghe_jilani

    saghe_jilani New Member

    This might help


    Please do dua for this nacheez.

    JazakAllahu khayrun
  2. Khaadim al-Mustafa

    Khaadim al-Mustafa New Member

    Also, I've been trying to find lyrics of a manqabat starting "Pukaro Shahe Jilan ko pukaro". I've found mostly Qawwali renditions of the poem and I'm trying to stay away from music.
  3. khaadim bhai,

    that naat has already been translated both by sidi abu hasan and myself in this thread:

  4. Wadood

    Wadood Veteran

    Sidi Khaadhim but it is best, if you want to learn conversational urdu fast, to join with Pakistani/Indians a few times a week and eat food with them. You will learn urdu quick. I have sent you a private message. Can you check it please.
  5. Khaadim al-Mustafa

    Khaadim al-Mustafa New Member

    Since I'm studying Urdu through naats (Alahazrat is my favourite poet) and you like to translate, might I suggest that you translate Alahazrat's naat Wo su-e laalazaar phirte hain? I'm interested in translating Alahazrat's poetry into Finnish, but my Urdu isn't strong enough yet. English translations would benefit me in grasping the meanings and increase my vocabulary.
  6. masha Allah.
    you're a mureed of shaykh nuh? that's nice :)
    the reliance is a wonderful book to have...
  7. Wadood

    Wadood Veteran

    Shaykh NuH Ha Mim Keller had a beautiful suhba in Toronto last month. Hundreds of murids from North America were there. Shaykh Faraz, Shaykh Talal, and Shaykh Zahir were also there.

    The masjid is run by an excellent Pakistani elder with a very sufi heart, alHamduLilAllah who was announcing the printing of an English exegesis by a scholar in Toronto.

    Sidi Khaadim al-Mustafa, I have sent you a private message, can you please check it.
  8. Khaadim al-Mustafa

    Khaadim al-Mustafa New Member

    I know. I constitute one third of them. I wish there was more of us. It's difficult to talk about Sufism with many people although there's an enormous need for spirituality and purification of hearts.
  9. faqir

    faqir Veteran

    there are some murids of sh. nuh in finland...
    pm me if you are interested.
  10. Khaadim al-Mustafa

    Khaadim al-Mustafa New Member

    I'm afraid the Tatars of Finland are probably more lost than Finnish converts. They have a mosque in Helsinki, but the mosque is open for zuhr and juma only (plus tarawih in Ramadan). The Tatars have little contact with other Muslims with the exception of Turks probably. They have preserved their language and culture remarkably well but they consider preserving their ethnic and linguistic identity more important than Islam. I reckon that the young and middle-aged among them are irreligious and don't observe prayer or hijab even if they considered themselves Muslims. I have visited their mosque once for Juma and their practices were clearly Hanafi but also I saw women entering the mosque without any hijab and they also shook hands with the imam after the prayer. I haven't been there ever since.
  11. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    so what is your point? the word adultery is mentioned in the qur'an; do we then tell jokes about fornication now?

    al-iyadhu billah.
  12. Wadood

    Wadood Veteran

    Sidi Asif your comment was just not appropriate for that situation. Why compare stereotypes to what you post above. How do we know that mentioning those stereotypes would not have had offended brother Khadhim. We are not discussing fiqh of the bedroom are we?
  13. at the risk of antoginising you fiurther bro aH -- and i do this with tongue firmly in cheek--i think islamic literature is full of references to 'making love' [is that a dirty thing (with one's spouse or concubine)?] and even 'blondes'. some names i can think of are,Suyuti who starts one of his books with the words, [in his book, "Kitab al-Idah fi ilm al-nikah"]:
    • "May Allah grant glory and eternal salvation to those who know how to stroke a soft cheek in an accomplished manner, to give a just accolade to a slender waist, and to enter the sweetest farj (yoni) with a befitting skill!",

    Last edited: May 27, 2008
  14. Wadood

    Wadood Veteran

    Please don't forget the Tataar of Finland who migrated there during 1st world war. They have still maintained their Islamic culture to a surprisingly large extent. The Tataari are still very much Sunni and not that much influenced by the wahabis as the Finnish/Sweedish converts.

    But the Tatari are a small community of may be 2000 or so? I am not sure in Finland of 5.5 million people?

    They are Hanafi and have traditional Sunni Islam alive in many circles still. They visit Turkey often.

    I love Habib Kadhim, he is amaizing. He was attacked by the wahabis in yemen-Hadramaut physically. But Allah ta'ala has protected him. Habib Kadhim is such a charasmatic, energetic da'i of Islam, all the Habaib are, the progeny of RasulAllah sallAllaho 'alaihi wa alihi wa sallam.

    I wish brother Khadhim health and strength against the incurable illness he has. InshaAllah, inshaAllah he won't notice it, and would be able to di what he whats with full concentration and himma, inshaAllah, Ameen.
  15. well maybe you are right but what gives you the right to criticise shaykh kabbani in public?

    when i translate ala hazrat i don't add or take anything of my own-my translations are just that; done for love of ala hazrat and love of poetry. of my own self i know i know nothing.
    i have many faults--some of which you have highlighted. so, shouldn't i worry about myself and not about shuyukh?
  16. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    i have been called out for saying this in a different tense, but i will try again - hopeful that you and your friends won't be offended.

    if you are a layperson who cannot differentiate the obvious, why should you be 'defending' someone with proofs that you carve out yourself. i mean, the only way of 'defending' is by stating your sharayi proofs or quote a scholar. if not, is it wrong to keep quiet obeying the noble injunction: 'speak right or keep quiet'?

    if you claim ignorance, then by alaHazrat's fatwa, you have no business explaining [religious] poetry and elucidating sufi literature. how can you speak of a lofty matter which is off-limits for even scholars until they are proficient [like ibn arabi's works] whereas plead ignorance for common rulings, which can be found in books of fatawa with little effort and average intelligence?

    incidentally, i was reading a fatwa of alaHazrat just a while ago which is so apt to your objections, that i must translate it - or atleast the relevant part of it. inshaAllah wa bi tawfiqih.

    Allah ta'ala knows best.
  17. brother khaadim al-finlandi [btw i find this arabization a rather amusing trend: al-kannadi, al-finlandi, al-brittani etc. it is a part of the salafist influence methinks on muslims everywhere. whats wrong with our regional names?]

    thank you very much for your response, it was most enlightening. i wish you all the best in your studies. one of the best ways to learn a lingo is to listen to music in that language. if you don't want to listen to music then naats would be excellent. only thing is the urdu in many naats tends to be difficult and archaic.

    btw i hope you weren't offended by my listing of british stereotypes of scandinavia! if u were i apologise.

    sidi aH,

    the only point i try to make when i always defend shaykh kabbani is that since he is a sahih al aqidah sunni scholar we laypeople should withhould our tongues. if other sunni scholars have legitimate criticisms of him or any other sunni scholar it is for them to discuss with each other.

    the sufiyya e karaam can often do things which apparently appear to contradict shariah but in reality do not. there is the tale of a shaykh who was censured by other ahl e zaahir for always sitting in the company of beardless youth with a wine flask in front. when they confronted him he said the boy is my son and i only have water in this flask...

    what about hazrat sarmad shaheed who used to run around the streets of delhi naked? when he was executed by hazrat aurangzeb for being a heretic his severed head read the kalimah?!
  18. Khaadim al-Mustafa

    Khaadim al-Mustafa New Member

    I've been studying in Helsinki university for two years now and it might take a year or two to get bachelor's degree. I don't have much interest to continue in Finland after that because the resources in Arabic are very poor indeed. Also, the teachers are Orientalists who have little appreciation for any work authored by a Muslim. Our basic Arabic books have been authored by Lebanese Christians at the university of Michigan in 1960's and 70's and are of ridiculously poor Arabic devoid of practically any references to Islam or Arab culture.

    Last Ramadan, we were honoured by the visit of al-Habib Kazim al-Saqqaf of Tarim, Yemen. He was probably the first of the Haba'ib to visit Finland. If I remember correctly, a murid who was accompanying him told me about a Hanafi scholar Muhammad Muslim who is based in Gothenburg, Sweden.

    We do have our cultural peculiarities, though we're quite different from Sweden for example. It is said we're silent but I think that's only in comparison to the neighbouring peoples. I live in a student apartment with two other people. We all have our own rooms and we don't interact very much if there's no need. I can spend days without talking to anyone. I prefer silence over bad company but I should spend more time with people who remember Allah much.

    Our Muslim community doesn't have much inspiring gatherings, mawlids or the like. I see a great need for spirituality among Muslims, especially Finnish converts but it's hard to talk about spirituality and loud dhikr because of ignorant opposition (Naqshbandi practices like silent dhikr might be good for Finnish Muslims in general and one wouldn't have to worry about "bid'ah" shouts of the ignorant.).

    As for our knowledge of English, it has opened us many ways, both good and bad. We've learned our Islam from Saudi published garbage and we don't have any real printed alternatives. The level of people's proficiency in English varies so many would have hard time reading the excellent material found sites like Marifah or Living Islam.
  19. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    the point i am trying to make is not in this specific action though unfortunately, that is another one in the list. my references go back to a few posts and are some threads old;

    in your defence of shaykh kabbani, you simply said things that ought not to be said - but nobody seems to mind it. however, if someone is legitimately criticised, people will be quick to point out the arrogance of the critic amidst other accusations.

    a further point i am trying to make is [your issue is used here merely an illustration] whether we should completely abandon criticism/critical thinking and slavishly follow the scholar with the biggest following even if he contravenes our elders on a number of key issues?

    i am not talking about a specific person in the lines above - that is the order of the day; so do not put words in my mouth and take this discussion to mars. we are still on earth.
    Last edited: May 26, 2008
  20. brother AH,
    you are correct. what I wrote was NOT Islamic but I never said it was. I said these were BRITISH stereotypes of Scandinavia. I never mentioned Islam in that post. I also tried to be as polite as possible when thinking of which words to use. Maybe on an Islamic forum I shouldnt have written this but I do think it is not fair to link this to my defence of Shaykh Kabbani.

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