a karamah or not?

Discussion in 'Tasawwuf / Adab / Akhlaq' started by Noori, Feb 22, 2015.

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  1. Noori

    Noori Senior Moderator

    Common folks specially women always form thier beliefs when they observe something, while iman is bi'l ghayb.

    I have seen and heard many wierd beliefs (old) women hold and force on their families; for example

    - Growing chilies in your garden brings fighting among family members
    - Husband should not buy black clothes for his wife.
    - Doing niyaz on 13 safar, they call it terah taizi, and believe that it will remove all sort of taizi during the year. Doing niyaz is not bad, but it is this belief of 13 taizi
    - and all rusoom at wedding, mehdi, chothi etc, i really hate them
    Making taaq in house ang lighting candles/chiragh in it before maghrib and believing that souls of awliya (and some say jins) visit, they call it hazri.
  2. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    there's a bunch of bizarre rituals people follow in Muharram, i'm not just talking shias.

    i think the shias also mention their fire walking matam as a karamah of Muharram. they don't know that many other people too do it - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firewalking

    this is the physics behind it, even if some may think knowledge is a veil to "mysteries" - http://io9.com/5928230/the-physics-of-firewalking (read the comments too)
  3. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    it should only give the awam bad name really, and even then in reality our opponents can pick on only 2 or 3 things - niyaz, dargahs, qawwali

    "Barelvis" are unfairly targeted, as the deos know very well what Ala Hazrat said regarding women visiting dargahs, what he said regarding qawwalis, what he said about chadars on mazars, and they also know his stance on niyaz and Fatiha, and if they have any shame, they'd even know about Shah Waliullah's stand on it

    as far as wazaif and 3amaliyat are concerned, i'd say the deos and "Barelvis" are about the same. just have a read of thanvi's a3male Qurani. you will find many such wazaif/3amaliyat similar in spirit to this sugar plate thing, and beyond that too.
  4. sherkhan

    sherkhan Veteran

    Unfortunately such superstitious behaviour is prevalent amongst womenfolk (apologies if this sounds chauvinistic, but it's a fact)

    I come from family and culture (eastern India/Bihar) where giving niyaz is very common, but I have never heard/seen anything as bizarre as this.


    Astaghfirullah. The Holy Qur'an says that martyr's provisions and sustenance are unlike what we can comprehend. Why would it need to "take a bit from food"?

    This is awful; gives Barelvis bad name.
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2015
  5. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    the lady who suggested this to my mother, also mentioned the thing about the plate of sugar.
  6. Brother Barry

    Brother Barry Veteran

    I've heard of this being done here, been to a few house mehfils & hatham e Ghousiya & Qadriyya.. I noticed the household members with plates of sugar at some of these gatherings but I neither witnessed any writing nor did they show any to anyone there.

    I have read or heard (can't remember which) basically the same sentiments as the mufti saab mentioned in relation to this matter
  7. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.


    some lady told my mother to read Surah Yaseen 51 or 72 times (as opposed to Khatme Ghawthiya) in one sitting (one person or more than one person, whatever; also not sure about the exact number of recitations 51 or 72 or anything else) for subsiding any specific problem the family is facing, with the niyyah of attaining solution to that specific problem - a wazifa basically. my mother did it as told, in one sitting with 4 or 5 people from the family. i think on more than occasion she has witnessed the word "Allah" or "Muhammad" (3alaihis salam) etched on the sugar. i think the sugar was placed in a plate, covered by another plate on top, in the same room where we were sitting reading Surah Yaseen. i don't remember too well now if i was able to discern the word, but once i have also seen some form of etching on the sugar. in my case, we just put the sugar back in its jar/container and use it for our normal use, just considering it like niyaz food.

    the lady who told this to my mother is a pakistani lady.

    i agree with the mufti sab's sentiments though. this is why if someone in the family asks me to participate in such a gathering, i don't say no, but at the same time i try not to be too fixated on extras that i know might hurt the 3aqidah of others, specially women folk. that's why i never really actively focused on the sugar or the writing on it, even though i believe in the barakah of the Quran and Dhikr of Allah and the fuyuz of the awliyaa.

    in my family we know it, and i always reiterate to my mother or wife or sisters specially that wazaif are indeed beneficial just like duas, and we don't know what calamities they avoid, even if we don't see the benefit or solution that WE want to see, or in the time that we want to see them in.


    something similar.

    in UP there is another rasam in Muharram (i think 7th, or between 7th and 10th) where they do niyaz of Imam Hussein radi Allahu 3anhu at Maghreb time (or between Asr and Maghreb), and then leave the food alone in the room and close it. apparently they say Hazrat Ali (or maybe Imam Hussein's; radi Allahu 3anhuma) soul comes to the room and does an additional niyaz on the food (not sure) and apparently takes a bit from the food. some people have told me they've seen marks of fingers on the food.

    Allahu a3lam. in any case, if true, this is karamat of theirs (Hazrat Ali or Imam Hussein) and not the people of the house.
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2015
  8. Noori

    Noori Senior Moderator

    We've never heard or seen such pratice at the time of khatm ghosia sharif in pakistan. Molana sahab has rightly spoken against this pratice.
  9. Unbeknown

    Unbeknown Senior Moderator


    Recently we shifted house and as it was the month of gyarawih-shareef we had held a gathering of khatm-e-gawthiya for the ladies of the neighbourhood (this was a first since we never held such gatherings in our old house, it being in a patently wahhabi locality).

    A new and indeed a fascinating thing we were told is that before starting the khatm-shareef it is customary to keep a plate of sugar covered with a cloth somewhere in the house and after the khatm and dua this plate is uncovered whilst reciting durood shareef and usually (or rather always) the words "Allah" and/or "Muhammad" (peace be upon him) appear etched in the sugar, sometimes they are very clear, as if someone wrote them with a finger or stick while at other times they are only slightly perceptible!
    This sugar is then given away along with the niyaz.

    So we followed suit and both the words duly appeared etched in the sugar and I too saw them about 3-4 days later!

    The following day the same thing happened in a relative's house and their the word "Allah" was clearly visible. The third day in another neighbour's house the word "Allah" and a distinct impression of someone's palm was found in the sugar.

    As this was getting curiouser and curiouser I asked mufti aaqib kharbe regarding the phenomenon, if he too had witnessed this. He shook his head and replied that we should put a stop to such things since they could seriously injure people's aqidah. First of all it's not a given that whenever the khatm is recited the words will definitely appear and those for whom they don't appear will be looked at with suspicion, their niyyah or the source of their income will be doubted etc. and because of this some people may lose the aqeedat they had for gawth-e-'azam (raDiyaalhu anhu). Some others may start reciting the khatm just to see these words miraculously appear in their plates of sugar, reducing the zikr of Allah to some sort of a 'lets see what happens' game.

    I would like to know if things of this sort occur in other parts of the world. Anyone witnessed something similar?

    Spin no yarns, please!

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