examining the christmas speech of prof.tahir, leader of minhaj

Discussion in 'Refutation' started by naqshbandijamaati, Nov 6, 2011.

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  1. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    akhi KS, what about his long list of ijaza's from various shuyukh?

    are they real or manufactured? (or do they even exist? but as i know, i think some do. pardon my ignorance on shakhsiyaat)
     
  2. kattarsunni

    kattarsunni Veteran

    Professor Tahir has NOT studied the intensive 6 years of Dars e Nizami. He would attend the durus of Allama Saeed Ahmed Kazmi as a listener (mustami').
    Because of his oratory skills and good research skills the Ulama encouraged him to lecture to counter Dr. Israr who was gaining prominence at that time.

    When his following grew he made a drastic change to politics and made his bold claim on the diya (blood money) issue the U'lama opposed him.
    When he came to Jami'a Nizamia one of the U'lama opened Usul alShashi and told him to explain a difficult passage. When he was not able to do so the Scholar said 'You have guts going against ijma' and Imam Abu Hanifah on the diya mas'ala'.

    He was opposed at that time by many U'lama and this is well known.

    This was the period when his fitna started in the early eighties:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TsC5y1B7zh4

    At the end of this lecture he mentions that he invited Allama Abdul Qayum Hazarvi rahimahuAllah to debate the issue!!

    If he qualifies for being 'Shaykh alIslam' or 'Mujaddid' he must have at least memorised the Quran?

    Has he memorised the Quran?
     
  3. abdarrashid

    abdarrashid Active Member

    how knowledgeable is tahir al-qadri?(is this subjective? (i am sure there are certain standards.)
    i mean has he just done the standard 6 years of dars-i-nizami without any further studies in the traditional way, specialising in some areas of study under traditional ulama(how many years did he do this?), since i dont think a phd counts in becoming a shaykh al-Islam and mujadid or does it?
    do you think this and coming generations may have more mujadids, shaykh al-Islams etc with just an introduction to traditional Islamic education(which is what the 6 year dars-i-nizami is ) with an m.a. or phd for secular credibility?
    i am not saying this in the case of tahir al-qadri, but i dont know his background.
     
  4. chisti-raza

    chisti-raza Veteran

  5. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    another hadith from Sahih Muslim (this is the one that forbids respect to jews and christians, the former one was stating in explicit words that they are dwellers of hellfire if they do not accept Prophet Muhammad, sal Allahu 3alaihi wa sallam, prophethood)

    لا تبدؤا الْيَهُودَ ولا النَّصَارَى بِالسَّلَامِ فإذا لَقِيتُمْ أَحَدَهُمْ في طَرِيقٍ فَاضْطَرُّوهُ إلى أَضْيَقِهِ

    --- regarding my previous post, where I said:

    he constructed a very clever argument to say: "my dear brothers and sisters in christianity. it is not important to accept the messenger-hood of Prophet Muhammad, sal Allahu 3alaihi wa sallam, to be called a believer. just accepting the messengerhood of 3eisa 3alaihis salam is enough!" - THIS is what his argument translates to effectively.

    --> please note that this is after MAXIMUM POSSIBLE positive tawil on his words "belief in 3eisa 3alaihis salam" which if we are to examine cynically considering his politician status, could fit to both Muslim belief regarding him (messenger) as well as the christian one ("son of god" - subhaanahu an yakoona lahu walad). however, i have chosen to take it in a positive way regarding the Muslim belief (messenger)
     
  6. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    From Imam Al-Jassas's Ahkam Al-Quran

    Regarding verse 5:51
    - الجزء الثاني - قوله تعالى : ( يا أيها الذين آمنوا لا تتخذوا اليهود والنصارى أولياء بعضهم أولياء بعض ) روي عن عكرمة أنها نزلت في أبي لبابة بن عبد المنذر لما تنصح إلى بني قريظة وأشار إليهم بأنه الذبح . وقال السدي : لما كان بعد أحد خاف قوم من المشركين ، حتى قال رجل : أو إلى اليهود ، وقال آخر : أو إلى النصارى ؛ فأنزل الله تعالى هذه الآية . وقال عطية بن سعد : " نزلت في عبادة بن الصامت وعبد الله بن أبي ابن سلول ، لما تبرأ عبادة من موالاة اليهود وتمسك بها عبد الله بن أبي وقال أخاف الدوائر " . والولي هو الناصر ؛ لأنه يلي صاحبه بالنصرة ، وولي الصغير لأنه يتولى التصرف عليه بالحياطة ، وولي المرأة عصبتها لأنهم يتولون عليها عقد النكاح . . وفي هذه الآية دلالة على أن الكافر لا يكون وليا للمسلم لا في التصرف ولا في النصرة ؛ ويدل على وجوب البراءة من الكفار والعداوة لهم ؛ لأن الولاية ضد العداوة ، فإذا أمرنا بمعاداة اليهود والنصارى لكفرهم فغيرهم من الكفار بمنزلتهم . ويدل على أن الكفر كله - ص 623 - ملة واحدة ، لقوله تعالى : ( بعضهم أولياء بعض ) على أن اليهودي يستحق الولاية على النصراني في الحال التي كان يستحقها لو كان المولى عليه يهوديا ، وهو أن يكون صغيرا أو مجنونا وكذلك الولاية بينهما في النكاح هو على هذا السبيل . ومن حيث دلت على كون بعضهم أولياء بعض فهو يدل على إيجاب التوارث بينهما ، وعلى ما ذكرنا من كون الكفر كله ملة واحدة وإن اختلفت مذاهبه وطرقه . وقد دل على جواز مناكحة بعضهم لبعض ، اليهودي للنصرانية والنصراني لليهودية . وهذا الذي ذكرنا إنما هو في أحكامهم فيما بينهم ، وأما فيما بينهم وبين المسلمين فيختلف حكم الكتابي وغير الكتابي في جواز المناكحة وأكل الذبيحة

    Regarding Surah Kafiroon
    - الجزء الثالث - - ص 720 - ومن سورة الكافرين قوله تعالى : ( لكم دينكم ولي دين ) .
    قال أبو بكر : هذه الآية وإن كانت خاصة في بعض الكفار دون بعض ؛ لأن كثيرا منهم قد أسلموا ، وقد قال : ( ولا أنتم عابدون ما أعبد ) ، فإنها قد دلت على أن الكفر كله ملة واحدة ؛ لأن من لم يسلم منهم مع اختلاف مذاهبهم مرادون بالآية ، ثم جعل دينهم دينا واحدا ودين الإسلام دينا واحدا فدل على أن الكفر مع اختلاف مذاهبه ملة واحدة .
    آخر السورة

    Regarding verse 5:58
    - الجزء الثاني - قوله تعالى : ( يا أيها الذين آمنوا لا تتخذوا الذين اتخذوا دينكم هزوا ولعبا ) فيه نهي عن الاستنصار بالمشركين ؛ لأن الأولياء هم الأنصار . وقد روي عن النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم « أنه حين أراد الخروج إلى أحد جاء قوم من اليهود وقالوا : نحن نخرج معك ، فقال : إنا لا نستعين بمشرك » ، وقد كان كثير من المنافقين يقاتلون مع النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم المشركين . وقد حدثنا عبد الباقي بن قانع قال : حدثنا أبو مسلم : حدثنا حجاج : حدثنا حماد عن محمد بن إسحاق عن الزهري : « أن ناسا من اليهود غزوا مع النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم فقسم لهم كما قسم للمسلمين » . وقد روي عن النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم أيضا ما حدثنا محمد بن بكر قال : حدثنا أبو داود قال : حدثنا مسدد ويحيى بن معين قالا : حدثنا يحيى عن مالك عن الفضل عن عبد الله بن نيار عن عروة عن - ص 628 - عائشة قال يحيى : « إن رجلا من المشركين لحق بالنبي صلى الله عليه وسلم ليقاتل معه فقال : ارجع ثم اتفقا فقال : إنا لا نستعين بمشرك » . وقال أصحابنا : لا بأس بالاستعانة بالمشركين على قتال غيرهم من المشركين إذا كانوا متى ظهروا كان حكم الإسلام هو الظاهر ، فأما إذا كانوا لو ظهروا كان حكم الشرك هو الغالب فلا ينبغي للمسلمين أن يقاتلوا معهم . ومستفيض في أخبار أهل السير ونقلة المغازي : أن « النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم قد كان يغزو ومعه قوم من اليهود في بعض الأوقات وفي بعضها قوم من المشركين » . وأما وجه الحديث الذي قال فيه : « إنا لا نستعين بمشرك » فيحتمل أن يكون النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم لم يثق بالرجل وظن أنه عين للمشركين ، فرده وقال : " إنا لا نستعين بمشرك " يعني به من كان في مثل حاله .

    Al-Ghazali defining Islam and kufr and stating explicitly that christians and jews are kafirs

    الكفر: هو تكذيب الرسول،عليه الصلاة والسلام، في شيء مما جاء به

    والإيمان: تصديقه في جميع ما جاء به.

    فاليهودي والنصراني: كافران ؛ لتكذيبهما للرسول عليه الصلاة والسلام
    فيصل التفرقة بين الإسلام والزندقة

    ------

    As a side note, on the topic of "laa nafarriqu bayna ahadim mirrusulih", the jahil wahabis use this argument to downplay the fadeelah of our Master over other ambiyaa. This is easily refuted by the verse of the Quran "tilkar rusulu faddalna":

    تِلْكَ الرُّسُلُ فَضَّلْنَا بَعْضَهُمْ عَلَى بَعْضٍ مِّنْهُم مَّن كَلَّمَ اللّهُ وَرَفَعَ بَعْضَهُمْ دَرَجَاتٍ وَآتَيْنَا عِيسَى ابْنَ مَرْيَمَ الْبَيِّنَاتِ وَأَيَّدْنَاهُ بِرُوحِ الْقُدُسِ وَلَوْ شَاء اللّهُ مَا اقْتَتَلَ الَّذِينَ مِن بَعْدِهِم مِّن بَعْدِ مَا جَاءتْهُمُ الْبَيِّنَاتُ وَلَـكِنِ اخْتَلَفُواْ فَمِنْهُم مَّنْ آمَنَ وَمِنْهُم مَّن كَفَرَ وَلَوْ شَاء اللّهُ مَا اقْتَتَلُواْ وَلَـكِنَّ اللّهَ يَفْعَلُ مَا يُرِيدُ
    Quran 2:253

    ---

    another side note (technical) - for some reason i couldn't post it all in the same post, and it didn't allow me to right-align the arabic content. in fact the editor ate my entire content, and just displayed my nickname with a blank post.
     
  7. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    I'm sorry I don't have the time or the skills for a fast good translation, but most people here can understand the quoted bits.

    the padri has deliberately only mentioned that disbelief in Seyyidina 3eisa 3alaihis salam [as a Messenger] is not belief in Islam. This is true. However, it is for the purpose of seeking respect from christians. (if I remember well, he just speaks about "belief in him" without pointing towards the elephant in the room, ie., the christians filthy "son of god" concept vs our acceptance of him as a messenger)

    الَّذِينَ يَتَّخِذُونَ الْكَافِرِينَ أَوْلِيَاء مِن دُونِ الْمُؤْمِنِينَ أَيَبْتَغُونَ عِندَهُمُ الْعِزَّةَ فَإِنَّ العِزَّةَ لِلّهِ جَمِيعًا
    Quran 4:139


    Islam/iman is defined by belief in ALL the prophets of Allah. This is the meaning of "laa nufarriqu bayna ahadim mirrusulih". The padri clearly and deliberately leaves that out.


    قُولُواْ آمَنَّا بِاللّهِ وَمَآ أُنزِلَ إِلَيْنَا وَمَا أُنزِلَ إِلَى إِبْرَاهِيمَ وَإِسْمَاعِيلَ وَإِسْحَقَ وَيَعْقُوبَ وَالأسْبَاطِ وَمَا أُوتِيَ مُوسَى وَعِيسَى وَمَا أُوتِيَ النَّبِيُّونَ مِن رَّبِّهِمْ لاَ نُفَرِّقُ بَيْنَ أَحَدٍ مِّنْهُمْ وَنَحْنُ لَهُ مُسْلِمُونَ
    Quran 2:136

    كُلٌّ آمَنَ بِاللّهِ وَمَلآئِكَتِهِ وَكُتُبِهِ وَرُسُلِهِ لاَ نُفَرِّقُ بَيْنَ أَحَدٍ مِّن رُّسُلِهِ
    Quran 2:285

    قُلْ آمَنَّا بِاللّهِ وَمَا أُنزِلَ عَلَيْنَا وَمَا أُنزِلَ عَلَى إِبْرَاهِيمَ وَإِسْمَاعِيلَ وَإِسْحَقَ وَيَعْقُوبَ وَالأَسْبَاطِ وَمَا أُوتِيَ مُوسَى وَعِيسَى وَالنَّبِيُّونَ مِن رَّبِّهِمْ لاَ نُفَرِّقُ بَيْنَ أَحَدٍ مِّنْهُمْ وَنَحْنُ لَهُ مُسْلِمُونَ
    Quran 3:84

    Furthermore,

    1) Islam/iman is defined by belief in Seyyidina RasulAllah. Just as disbelief in 3eisa, 3ala nabiyyina wa 3alahis salam, makes a man a kafir, then what about the person who disbelieves in our Master Muhammad, 3alaihis salam???

    2) the padri deliberately and very cleverly constructed an argument to leave this very definition of iman and islam out of his speech, and the former argument listed above (that disbelieving in Jesus makes one a kafir) is contingent to this one (belief in Prophet Muhammad is mandatory to be called Muslim, 3alaihimus salam). he constructed a very clever argument to say: "my dear brothers and sisters in christianity. it is not important to accept the messenger-hood of Prophet Muhammad, sal Allahu 3alaihi wa sallam, to be called a believer. just accepting the messengerhood of 3eisa 3alaihis salam is enough!" - THIS is what his argument translates to effectively.

    3) if one was to do tawil of his words towards the negative end, one would deem him as a shatim ar-rasool, but we are not doing that.

    4) although point 2 is not declaring his statements as "kufriya by tawil" but rather a DIRECT and MANIFEST implication of his words, we will leave that too alone;

    BECAUSE

    the one thing that is as manifest as the mid-day sun is the padri's personally slaughtering of any chances of people to give him a benefit of doubt by looking for a positive tawil. he has given us no room for a positive tawil on his words by manifestly declaring the word "kafir" in a shar3iy context and then going on to manifestly say that christians and jews are not kafirs. he makes his point very manifestly, calculatingly, and articulately, knowing full well what he is saying.

    The verses/quotes below show clearly that belief in Prophet Muhammad, sal Allahu 3alaihi wa sallam, is the very essence of Islam, that Islam is THE ONLY religion acceptable to Allah; the hadith shows that the Prophet forbade honoring of christians and jews, despite some fiqh exceptions of dealing with them as opposed to other kafirs, and they show that ALL of kufr is eventually ONE NATION.

    وَمَن يُشَاقِقِ الرَّسُولَ مِن بَعْدِ مَا تَبَيَّنَ لَهُ الْهُدَى وَيَتَّبِعْ غَيْرَ سَبِيلِ الْمُؤْمِنِينَ نُوَلِّهِ مَا تَوَلَّى وَنُصْلِهِ جَهَنَّمَ وَسَاءتْ مَصِيرًا
    Quran 4:115

    إِنَّ الَّذِينَ يَكْفُرُونَ بِاللّهِ وَرُسُلِهِ وَيُرِيدُونَ أَن يُفَرِّقُواْ بَيْنَ اللّهِ وَرُسُلِهِ وَيقُولُونَ نُؤْمِنُ بِبَعْضٍ وَنَكْفُرُ بِبَعْضٍ وَيُرِيدُونَ أَن يَتَّخِذُواْ بَيْنَ ذَلِكَ سَبِيلاً
    أُوْلَـئِكَ هُمُ الْكَافِرُونَ حَقًّا وَأَعْتَدْنَا لِلْكَافِرِينَ عَذَابًا مُّهِينًا
    وَالَّذِينَ آمَنُواْ بِاللّهِ وَرُسُلِهِ وَلَمْ يُفَرِّقُواْ بَيْنَ أَحَدٍ مِّنْهُمْ أُوْلَـئِكَ سَوْفَ يُؤْتِيهِمْ أُجُورَهُمْ وَكَانَ اللّهُ غَفُورًا رَّحِيمًا
    Quran 4:150-152

    وَمَن لَّمْ يُؤْمِن بِاللَّهِ وَرَسُولِهِ فَإِنَّا أَعْتَدْنَا لِلْكَافِرِينَ سَعِيرًا
    Quran 48:13

    وَالَّذِي نَفْسُ مُحَمَّدٍ بِيَدِهِ لَا يَسْمَعُ بِي أَحَدٌ مِنْ هَذِهِ الْأُمَّةِ يَهُودِيٌّ وَلَا نَصْرَانِيٌّ ثُمَّ يَمُوتُ وَلَمْ يُؤْمِنْ بِالَّذِي أُرْسِلْتُ بِهِ إِلَّا كَانَ مِنْ أَصْحَابِ النَّار
    Hadith Sahih Muslim

    إِنَّ الدِّينَ عِندَ اللّهِ الإِسْلاَمُ وَمَا اخْتَلَفَ الَّذِينَ أُوْتُواْ الْكِتَابَ إِلاَّ مِن بَعْدِ مَا جَاءهُمُ الْعِلْمُ بَغْيًا بَيْنَهُمْ وَمَن يَكْفُرْ بِآيَاتِ اللّهِ فَإِنَّ اللّهِ سَرِيعُ الْحِسَابِ
    Quran 3:19

    وَمَن يَبْتَغِ غَيْرَ الإِسْلاَمِ دِينًا فَلَن يُقْبَلَ مِنْهُ وَهُوَ فِي الآخِرَةِ مِنَ الْخَاسِرِينَ
    Quran 3:85
     
  8. sunnistudent

    sunnistudent Veteran

    [FONT=&quot]قُلْ يَا أَهْلَ الْكِتَابِ تَعَالَوْا إِلَىٰ كَلِمَةٍ سَوَاءٍ بَيْنَنَا وَبَيْنَكُمْ أَلَّا نَعْبُدَ إِلَّا اللَّهَ وَلَا نُشْرِكَ بِهِ شَيْئًا وَلَا يَتَّخِذَ بَعْضُنَا بَعْضًا أَرْبَابًا مِّن دُونِ اللَّهِ ۚ فَإِن تَوَلَّوْا فَقُولُوا اشْهَدُوا بِأَنَّا مُسْلِمُونَ[/FONT]
    Surah Aal e Imran , ayat 64

    3:64 Say: "O People of the Book! come to common terms as between us and you: That we worship none but Allah. that we associate no partners with him; that we erect not, from among ourselves, Lords and patrons other than Allah." If then they turn back, say ye: "Bear witness that we (at least) are Muslims (bowing to Allah.s Will).

    This verse is telling the Jews and the Christians ( ahlul kitab) not to worship any other being except AllaH.


    Did they (Jews and the Christians) accept this command of AllaH?
    The answer is in Qur’an itself.


    [FONT=&quot]وَقَالَتِ الْيَهُودُ عُزَيْرٌ ابْنُ اللَّهِ وَقَالَتِ النَّصَارَى الْمَسِيحُ ابْنُ اللَّهِ ۖ ذَ*ٰلِكَ قَوْلُهُم بِأَفْوَاهِهِمْ ۖ يُضَاهِئُونَ قَوْلَ الَّذِينَ كَفَرُوا مِن قَبْلُ ۚ قَاتَلَهُمُ اللَّهُ ۚ أَنَّىٰ يُؤْفَكُونَ[/FONT]

    [FONT=&quot]تَّخَذُوا أَحْبَارَهُمْ وَرُهْبَانَهُمْ أَرْبَابًا مِّن دُونِ اللَّهِ وَالْمَسِيحَ ابْنَ مَرْيَمَ وَمَا أُمِرُوا إِلَّا لِيَعْبُدُوا إِلَـٰهًا وَاحِدًا ۖ لَّا إِلَـٰهَ إِلَّا هُوَ ۚ سُبْحَانَهُ عَمَّا يُشْرِكُونَ[/FONT]

    Surah At Taubah , ayat 30 and 31


    9:30The Jews call 'Uzair a son of Allah, and the Christians call Christ the son of Allah. That is a saying from their mouth; (in this) they but imitate what the unbelievers of old used to say. Allah.s curse be on them: how they are deluded away from the Truth!



    9:31They take their priests and their anchorites to be their lords in derogation of Allah, and (they take as their Lord) Christ the son of Mary; yet they were commanded to worship but One Allah. there is no god but He. Praise and glory to Him: (Far is He) from having the partners they associate (with Him).


    These verses clearly prove that the Jews and Christians made partners to AllaH. Hence they committed shirk and kufr.

    [FONT=&quot]
    [/FONT]
     
  9. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    yes, the translation is not 'blaspheme' but: 'have committed kufr'.
     
  10. sunnistudent

    sunnistudent Veteran

    [FONT=&quot]َ[/FONT] [FONT=&quot]لَقَدْ كَفَرَ الَّذِينَ قَالُوا إِنَّ اللَّهَ هُوَ الْمَسِيحُ ابْنُ مَرْيَمَ ۖ وَقَالَ الْمَسِيحُ يَا بَنِي إِسْرَائِيلَ اعْبُدُوا اللَّهَ رَبِّي وَرَبَّكُمْ ۖ إِنَّهُ مَن يُشْرِكْ بِاللَّهِ فَقَدْ حَرَّمَ اللَّهُ عَلَيْهِ الْجَنَّةَ وَمَأْوَاهُ النَّارُ ۖ وَمَا لِلظَّالِمِينَ مِنْ أَنصَارٍ[/FONT]

    [FONT=&quot]لَّقَدْ كَفَرَ الَّذِينَ قَالُوا إِنَّ اللَّهَ ثَالِثُ ثَلَاثَةٍ ۘ وَمَا مِنْ إِلَـٰهٍ إِلَّا إِلَـٰهٌ وَاحِدٌ ۚ وَإِن لَّمْ يَنتَهُوا عَمَّا يَقُولُونَ لَيَمَسَّنَّ الَّذِينَ كَفَرُوا مِنْهُمْ عَذَابٌ أَلِيمٌ[/FONT]



    ( Quran sherif, Surah Maida, ayat 72 and 73)



    72 They do blaspheme who say: "(Allah) is Christ the son of Mary." But said Christ: "O Children of Israel! worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord." Whoever joins other gods with Allah,- Allah will forbid him the garden, and the Fire will be his abode. There will for the wrong-doers be no one to help.


    73 They do blaspheme who say: Allah is one of three in a Trinity: for there is no god except One Allah. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them.


    Insha AllaH, more later.
     
  11. Muhammad Ali

    Muhammad Ali Veteran

    Why would the Jews and Christians accept Islam if they are believers like Muslims? What is the point of holding such gatherings if you are not going to bring them close to Islam?
     
  12. sunnistudent

    sunnistudent Veteran

    I was also shocked when Prof. Tahir says in his speech:[3:18 onwards]
    " as per Islamic belief, if a person recites kalima, performs salah, gives zakat,performs hajj,fasts, believes in quran and all other teachings of Islam, also practices these teachings in his life, but if he does not believe in Sayyedina Isa bin Maryam alayhis salam , his miracles, his respect, then he will be a Kafir"

    [ What prof Tahir told is correct] But listen his next line, he says( rough translation)
    "The people of this world are divided into 2 class ; believers and non-believers. The Muslims , Jews and Christians are called ' believers'..... ( and then he continues)

    You see, the jews and christians are still believers as per Prof. Tahir, even though they ascribe partners to AllaH, do not believe in Quran etc.

    I sincerely hope some follower of Prof Tahir will contact him to do ruju on this matter and other matters as well .One should not have ego in matters of Islam.
     
  13. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    al-iyadhu billah! you are certainly correct.

    the habib sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam, was vouchsafed from all khabayith even prior to [proclaiming] nubuwwah; so much so that when he was young, his uncles took him to a fair against his wish - and sleep overcame him and he slept throughout, and awoke only when the fair was over. the habib is ma'sum sallAllahu ta'ala alayhi wa sallam.

    ---
    it was a mix of sentences and i never intended that way. astaghfirullahi'l azeem. it did not even cross my mind in this manner. i have amended the paragraph. [it was late in the night and i had not slept for more than 20 hours]

    jazakAllahu khayran for the catch - and for adab, i have also amended your quoting me.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2011
  14. sunnistudent

    sunnistudent Veteran

    [FONT=&quot]
    A few of the Prof Tahir's act under consideration:

    1)His cutting the Christmas cake in Pakistan
    2)his calling of Christians (and Jews)as believers in the above linked You tube video and
    3)his calling the Khilafat of Afzal al bashar, ba'ad al al ambiya , sayyedina Abu Bakr Siddiq radi allahu anhu as Siyasi and zahiri khalifa

    There are other acts of Prof. Tahir which can be analysed, but for the time being I will consider only these three. Those who take interest in this issue , know that the fatwa on above matter was given many years back. I have a copy of this , which might be posted in this thread.

    Those who bring quotes of Syrian scholars proving that they bestowed the title of "shaykh al Islam" should prove that:

    These videos/ quotes of Prof Tahir were provided to these Syrian Schoalrs and they after watching/ reading the actions/ words of Prof. Tahir agreed with Prof Tahir.

    They should also provide the date / year when this title was bestowed by the syrian scholars .They should also provide the date of "cake cutting" ceremony and the date/ year of the above you tube video.

    Later, classical books of aqida and fiqh can be quoted to analyse the actions of Prof.Tahir.

    --
    I am interested to know what unity has Prof Tahir brought among the muslims.
     
  15. abdarrashid

    abdarrashid Active Member

    i meant to say considering the notoriety tahir qadri is held in, would this suppossed shiney appraisal by some syrians not make sunnis look bad, regardless of what part of the world they maybe coming from?
     
  16. abdarrashid

    abdarrashid Active Member

    how many of his works are available in arabic or are the opinions by the shamis based on them reading translations?
    which part of his work is reviving/revived the Deen?
    if the above is true, can what they said be interpreted otherwise?
    do you not think sunnis get laughed at because of this?

    p.s.i must add, i was shocked
     
  17. kattarsunni

    kattarsunni Veteran

    So this is not limited to calling him 'Shaykh alIslam' but also 'Mujaddid'!!

    Secondly, comparing him to Imam Badr alDin alHasani rahimahu Allah!!

    If anyone has this video of Tahir being announced as Shaykh alIslam and Mujaddid in Syria it would be greatly appreciated.

    What were the views of the major Ulama of Pakistan regarding Tahir like Ata Muhammad Bandyalvi, AbdulQayum Hazarvi, Fayd Ahmed Owaisi, etc etc?

    Lastly if we accept Tahir as Mujaddid does that mean we accept Christians and Jews as Mu'minin?
     
  18. abdarrashid

    abdarrashid Active Member

    Assalam ualaykum
    someone posted this is in feb of this year on bewleyupdates.
    what i wantd to know was, are the claims made below about tahir al-qadri true, especially about what the syrian shayukh have suppossedly said(i mean for example comparing him to lofty imams like imam Badr al-din al-Hasani?can anyone verfiy this?
    are they mistaken, because they dont know of his activities etc?

    __-----Original Message-----
    From: Rafiq Ahmad <rafiq786uk@yahoo.co.uk>
    To: Bewleyupdates@yahoogroups.com
    Sent: Sat, 5 Feb 2011 7:15
    Subject: Re: [Bewleyupdates] Khilafah


    "Munir Ahmed" <munirishere786@yahoo.co.uk>, why have you ignored my question

    about who your shaykh is or what group you follow? Is there a problem with him

    or is it a case of the group not having given any benefit to the Umma and only

    involves itself in slandering the `Ulamâ’ al-Haqq?

    I did not start calling him "Shaykh-ul-Islam" myself. This titled was given to

    him by the authorities of this Umma.

    * Dr Tahir-ul-Qadri first received the titled of “Shaykh-ul-Islam” from the

    great saintly and revolutionary figure, al-Mu`ammar Hadrat as-Sayyid Ghulâm

    Rasûl Shâh Khâkî of Chakwâl (Pîr Khâkî Shâh Sâhib) who had died at the age of

    130 years! He was a direct student of Imâm al-Hind Mawlânâ ash-Shâh Ahmad Ridâ

    Khân al-Barêlwî and was among the main khalîfas (spiritual successor) of

    Naqîbul-Ashrâf Sayyidunâ Ibrâhîm Sayfuddîn al-Jîlânî of Baghdad. He also had

    association with Pîr Shâh Sharafuddîn, Khawâja Muhammad Qâsim Kiyânî Moharwî,

    Sayyidunâ Mihr `Alî Shâh Golrawî, al-Hâfiz Khawâja `Abdul-Karîm [`Idghahi],

    as-Sayyid Jamâ`at `Alî Shâh al-Muhaddith `Alîpûrî, Yahyâ Qalandar, Mawlânâ Amjad

    `Alî Ridwî, Mawlânâ Kifâyatullâh Dehelwî and Mawlânâ Anwar Shâh Kashmîrî. He

    would give the title of “Shaykh-ul-Islam” to Shaykh Tahir-ul-Qadri and desired

    only for him to lead his janâza prayer. The

    Shaykh-ul-Hadîth of The Minhaj University, al-`Allâma Muhammad Mi`râj-ul-Islâm

    (direct student of Hadrat ash-Shaykh Muhammad Karam Shâh al-Azharî – quddisa

    sirruh) narrated directly (mubâsharan) that he heard ash-Shaykh as-Sayyid Ghulâm

    Rasûl Shâh Khâkî say:

    “mujhe HaDrat ghawth a`Zam sayyid `abdul-qâdir jîlânî raHmatullâhi `alayh ne

    Hukm diyâ he ke logo kô batâdô ke muHammad Tahir-ul-qâdrî shaykh-ul-islâm hê!”

    “Hadrat Ghawth A`zam Sayyid `Abdul-Qâdir Jîlânî ordered me to tell the people

    that Muhammad Tahir-ul-Qadri is Shaykh-ul-Islam!”

    He then sent a flag to Shaykh Tahir-ul-Qadri with the following written on it:

    “Shaykh-ul-Islam Professor Doctor Muhammad Tahir-ul-Qadri”. This flag was gifted

    by Shaykh-ul-Islam Dr Muhammad Tahir-ul-Qadri to Shaykh-ul-Hadîth al-`Allâma

    Muhammad Mi`râj-ul-Islâm who still has it among his possessions. So he was among

    the first to give the title of “Shaykh-ul-Islam” and that seems to be in the

    early 1990’s. The above has been reported by abundant witnesses amongst whom is

    the son of as-Sayyid Ghulâm Rasûl Shâh Khâkî, as-Sayyid Mahmûd-ul-Hasan Shâh

    Khâkî. The same has been related from as-Sayyid Ghulâm Rasûl Shâh Khâkî via many

    of his disciples and you can even ask them today to verify this.

    * His son, Pîr as-Sayyid Mahmûd-ul-Hasan Shâh Khâkî Qalandar writes in his book

    “Tadhkira e Khâkî”:

    “HaDrat pîr sayyid rasûl shâh khaki ne professor doctor muHammad Tâhir ul qâdrî

    kî dînî khidmât kô malhôZ khâTir rakthe hone unhe(n) shaykh ul islâm ke laqab sê

    nawâzâ. âp farmâyâ kartathe ke professor SâHib dîn kî khidmat ka kâm `aSr HâDir

    ke taqâDô ki `ayn muTbiq kar-rahêhê jô kê waqt kî Darûrat hê. âp sharî`at e

    muTahhara kî muTâbiq chal rahê... muSTafawî inqilâb ke liye tag o dô kar rahêhê

    mazîd farmâtêhê he agar kôî professor SâHib kî Himâyat nahî kartâ tô ussê

    mukhâlifat bhî nahî karnî châhyê. Âp farmâtêhê ke us jêsâ qâbil shakhS kâmilân e

    mushkil hê. aSl mê qâdrî SâHib ke murshid sayyidinâ TâHir `alâ’uddîn qâdrî kî un

    par khâS naZar hê jis ki waja sê in kâ kâm chal rahâhê.”

    “Hadrat Pîr Sayyid Rasûl Shâh Khâkî bestowed upon Professor Doctor Muhammad

    Tahir-ul-Qadri the title of Shaykh-ul-Islam after putting into consideration his

    services for the Dîn. He would often say that “Professor Sâhib’s service to the

    Dîn is exactly according to the times which is the need of this era. He is

    walking according to the Sharî`a. He is striving for Mustafawî Inqilâb.” He

    further said, “If someone is not supporting Professor Sâhib, atleast he should

    not oppose him.” He futher added, “Finding someone of his acceptance is

    difficult. To begin with, Qadri Sâhib’s murshid, Sayyidinâ Tâhir `Alâ’uddîn

    Qâdrî’s specific watch/vision is upon him due to which his work is continuing.”

    (Mahmûdul-Hasan Shâh Khâkî, Tadhkira-e-Khâkî, Section 3)

    * In August 2005 Dr Muhammad Tahir-ul-Qadri was announced as “Shaykh-ul-Islam”

    in a gathering of Syrian scholarly and saintly authorities at Jâmi`a Muhaddith

    al-Akbar (Damascus, Syria) which I myself was present in. Jâmi`a Muhaddith

    al-Akbar was opened by Hadrat Muhaddith al-Akbar al-Imâm Badruddîn al-Hasanî

    (quddisa sirruh) one of the top two greatest Hadîth authorities in Syria during

    his life. The awarding of the title of “Shaykh-ul-Islam” was headed by the

    following scholars who also pledged to work for the mission of Minhaj-ul-Qur’an

    for the uplift, unity and revival of this Ummah:

    * The head imam (khatîb al-a`zam) of the famous Jâmi`a Masjid Umawi ash-Shaykh

    al-Muhaddith al-Faqîh As’ad Muhammad Sa`îd as-Sâgharjî. He taught Hadîth in

    al-Madîna al-Munawwara for 8 years and is a prolific author, having written some

    important works such as “al-Fiqhul-Hanafî wa adillatuhû” (also translated into

    Urdu), “Zawjâtun-Nabî (s)”, “Sayyidunâ Muhammad Rasûlallâh (s) al-Uswah

    al-Hasanah”, “Muhabbah an-Nabî (s)”, “Hajj wal-`umrah” and “Shu`abul-Îmân” which

    are taught as part of the core syllabus of courses in al-Azhar and many

    universities and centres of learning in Syria, Lebanon, Iraq, Jordan, Pakistan,

    India and Saudi Arabia. He is the grand khatîb (khatîb al-a`zam) of Jâmi`a

    Masjid Umawî which has 9 khatîbs in total selected from the highest authorities

    of that land. This shaykh also conferred the title “al-`Ârif billâh” in addition

    to “Shaykh-ul-Islam” to Shaykh-ul-Islam Dr Muhammad

    Tahir-ul-Qadri.

    * The headmaster of al-Jâmi`a al-Muhaddith al-Akbar, ash-Shaykh Abul-Khayr

    ash-Shukrî is also an imam of the renowned Jâmi`a Masjid Umawî (Umayyad Mosque)

    and is among Syria’s highest Hadîth authorities. There is a type of exam held to

    select a khatîb for this mosque. Ash-Shaykh as-Sayyid Muhammad al-Ya`qûbî

    together with other erudite Syrian scholars also applied for the position at the

    same time as ash-Shaykh Abul-Khayr ash-Shukrî but only ash-Shaykh Abul-Khayr was

    selected. This shaykh also gave the title “Shaykh-ul-Islam”.

    * ash-Shaykh `Abdur-Razzâq ash-Shurafa and ash-Shaykh Shihâbuddîn al-Farfûr (son

    of Muhaddith ash-Shâm ash-Shaykh Sâlih al-Farfûr, founder of Jâmi` al-Fath) also

    spoke to make similar announcements. ash-Shaykh `Abdur-Razzâq ash-Shurafa began

    his lecture describing briefly certain aspects of the life of Hadrat Muhaddith

    al-Akbar al-Imâm Badruddîn al-Hasanî explaining how he became a mujaddid. He

    explained the criteria of a “Shaykh-ul-Islâm” and “mujaddid” during his

    discourse and concluded by saying that having studied the life and works and

    achievements of Dr Muhammad Tahir-ul-Qadri, he felt that he was the “Badruddîn

    Hasanî of this age” and that “our reliance is upon him”! Then the status of

    “Shaykh-ul-Islâm” was confired.

    I myself and the 300 other brothers and sisters who travelled with

    Shaykh-ul-Islam on this unforgettable spiritual tour all witnessed this event,

    al-Hamdulillah. I am prepared to perform mubâhala with anyone who disputes

    whether or not the above event took place (I can’t lie about what my own ears

    heard – anyway, it is on video). So this was a gathering where the scholarly

    (Qur’ânic term: “Those Who Know”) explained why they had applied this title to

    Shaykh-ul-Islam.

    Ash-Shaykh Ahmad az-Zubaydi of Syria who is from the family of Imam al-A`zam Abu

    Hanifa reports that he personally heard his shaykh, the great saint and sage of

    the past century, Sayyiduna as-Sayyid Tahir `Ala’uddin al-Gilani referring to

    Sayyidi Shaykh-ul-Islam as “Mujaddid (Reviver of Islam)”. Ash-Shaykh az-Zubaydi

    is a leading scholar whose father’s standing was such that he was known as Abu

    Hanifa as-Saghir.

    There are hundreds of pages of such announcements. The words of a few

    ignoramuses carry no weight and they should fear Allâh about speaking about what

    they are ignorant of.
     
  19. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    Fatawa Ridawiya quoting Qadi Iyad's Shifa

    Ridawiya Vol 15 Pg 442.JPG
     
  20. Ustadh Abu Hasan, I'm pretty sure the messenger sallaLlahu 'alayhi wa alihi wa sallam, although having approved of the above [before it was abrogated], did not perform it himself; it was part of his fitrah.

    was-salam
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 12, 2011

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