Fadak and khatā

Discussion in 'Aqidah/Kalam' started by AR Ahmed, Apr 4, 2023.

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  1. abu hamzah

    abu hamzah Active Member

  2. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

  3. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    it is time to push back.

    anyone who calls out their fasid aqidah and waywardness is liberally labelled a nasibi. time to call their bluff and ask them hard questions.
    Unbeknown likes this.
  4. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    it's a small victory for the liberal secularists (and their qadiyani lapdogs) - against the blasphemy law, regardless whether someone realizes it or not.

    even if Irfan Shah and Khadim Hussain say "Jalali was RIGHTLY arrested, there's no abuse of the law"

    even if Jalali HIMSELF says, "Please hang me but don't repeal the law"

    the liberal secularists (and their qadiyani lapdogs) will scream that it can be misapplied and abused. they will say of course we all love and respect the Prophet 3alaihis salam and even support this law in principle but it worked well for the glorious times of the Khilafate Raashidah and the other Sultanates, but these times are different and we need to consider changing times (they will present some logic like this)

    what all these peerzada's have conveniently forgotten is that Ashraf Jalali was responding to a rafidi hag.

    it's not fitting their agenda right now to respond to that rafidi female who opened her pie-hole against Abu Bakr Siddiq radi Allahu 3anhu

    go ask Kaukab Noorani to give a bayan at a gathering. he will read out his rate card for you, which includes charges for his 2 bodyguards too. (i think even salman khan has just one)

    maybe then, you'll have half a chance of extracting a statement from him.

    yes, he did tawba for calling Sayyidina Wahshi radi Allahu 3anhu as zalim. but why doesn't he speak up against open rafidis like hanif qureshi or that half-rafidi half-clown aamir liaqath.

    these people are all shaanay!

    wonder what they think of Sahibayn disagreeing with Imame A3azam

    Muzaffar Shah sahab - i hated his drawing circles around awam. he said change of words doesn't constitute rujoo3 in response to Ziaul Mustafa sahab. a well crafted sentence. what Jalali did was explain the words he uttered that he was referring to khata ijtihadi. it was not "lafzon ki tabdeeli", it was wazahat on his utterance of "khata". why are they so insistent on rujoo3? if they want rujoo3 they should prove that what he said is a bid3ah or a kufr or haram qat3i. i take his point about our times and the mahol of punjab and that this word might register harsher lughwi meanings in peoples heads, but then that is just maslaha/mafsadah issue. he can't force his opinion down someone's gut, and Jalali amply clarified that he was speaking in istilahi paradigm

    Khadim sahab - yeah well, i was starting to get fond of him when he spoke against european blasphemers like geert wilders. but i once saw a video of someone narrating a dream to him about a great wali praising him and apparently Khadim sahab said something like 'you should hear what Sayyidina Hamza radi Allahu 3anhu said about me in another dream to such and such person'. our job is to act on the zahir only. i still respect him for speaking against the european blasphemers. but if he's honest, let him show his opposition to the likes of hanif qureshi, Munawwar Shah's rafidi colleagues like shahbaz qamar fareedi and so on and we can accept that he is really genuinely annoyed by Jalali's words on the basis of sound principles

    Irfan Shah sahab - yeah well, sab jaante hain. but still, he has himself said there are 10 other angles he can respond to the shias from. let's see him take that rafidi hag that started it all, to task. let's see him blast shahbaz qamar fareedi rather than enjoying his naats. lets see him blast hanif qureshi, let's see him blast paqs once he returns to uk. let's see him come to uk and call the qadiyanis of uk as 'kuttay de puttar' and elaborate on their parents' lechery. let's see him speak up against open blasphemers of europe who like to burn the Quran or hurt the Prophet 3alaihis salam. let's see him put his money (and uk passport) where his mouth is

    it's all showbiz - halal showbiz

    99% of popular peers, muqarrirs and naatkhwans (notekhwans) are just stars in the 2020 showbiz istilahi sense in english (NOT the majazi sense for nujoom in Arabic as is used for Sahaba in hadith)

    you have bollywood masala movies - love story, opposing uncles, smugglers, angry cops, mafia, some comedy, some songs etc.

    these are Sunni masala movies - a majlis with fiery speech or two on some right or wrong fazail or karaamaat, firebrand slogans, naatkhwani (notekhwani with money being showered), some insults thrown at wahabis just to maintain Sunni flavor, lavishly praise Ala Hazrat and explain a word or two from his naats, recite his salam, some murgha and halwa at the end. oh and endless sessions of shakhsiyat parasti- super duper well crafted titles running into 7 lines, hand and feet kissing, and finally everyone walking out of the mehfil as an accomplished wali - what more do you want? (sometimes there are gifts of umrah tickets announced, or secret deals of western visas and immigration assistance)

    to be honest western celebrity shuyukh are no different except for some elements of the masala mix.
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2020
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  5. Mehmet Sekil

    Mehmet Sekil Active Member

    Allah Ta'ala grant the people of Pakistan steadfastness on the path of Ehl-iSünnet and allow them to stay firm on the way of their Ulama in particular Imam-i Ehl-iSünnet ve Mücceddidi Ahmâd Rîza Han Hâzretlerî and Hâzret Imâm-ı Rabbâni Ahmad Fârûkî Sirhandi Hâzretlerî (Kuddise Sirruhû)

    I am the slave of the lovers of the Prophet
    صلي الله عليه و سلم
    Neither a Kharijite nor a misled Shi’ite am I;
    I am the bondsman of Abu Bakr, ‘Umar and ‘Uthman,
    And I travel upon the path of ‘Ali, Allah's saint

    Esrar Dede (d.1797)
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2020
  6. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    here is an exercise. search the number of instances in the 9 books of hadith that refer to sayyiduna RasulAllah sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam as 'abu'z zahra' and compare with the number of instances in the same books referring to our master as 'abul qasim".
    Ghulam Ali likes this.
  7. sherkhan

    sherkhan Veteran

    It's bit of wishful thinking given the ground realities. As I said before, tafzilism is here to stay (it's a bane of subcontinent, more so in Pakistan than in India, if I may say so). More sunnis are likely to turn rafizis, than the other way around; bit like entropy/chaos, it's a one way traffic until the coming of Time.
  8. sherkhan

    sherkhan Veteran

    Mufti sahib makes an apt point. Rafizis/tafzilis be damned. abul Qasim is the preferred kunya (as is the practice of Arabs), even though lineage/sa'adats is/are from Sayyidah Fatima (radiAllahu anha).
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  9. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    when irfan shah comes back to the UK - every sunni should boycott him.
    let him go to his shiah friends and hobnob with them.

    don't give him space. don't give him space to set fire to ahl al-sunnah.

    i urge irfan shah to do tawbah and seek forgiveness of asif jalali. that is what the shariah commands. and fear for your aakhirah.

    al-dinu al-naSiHah.
  10. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    we will never spare anyone who looks at the ahl al-sunnah with evil intentions. and if need be, we can pluck out their eyes, bi idhnillah.

    a'ada se kahdo khayr manayen na sharr karen.

    [this particular post is not about irfan shah; it is about rawafid who are using him]
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2020
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  11. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    ok brother, so this is a maslaha/mafsadah point/counter-point between us forum members

    i agree that the next 2 (open tafdilis and taqiyyabaz rafidis/tafdilis) are relevant

    however, your point is - they should not be confronted with the kind of attitude the mufti (in post # 228) is suggesting.

    my point is that they should be smoked out of their holes
  12. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    there is only one yardstick. the shariat of mustafa. sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam.
    jo is se hate gaa, use kaat diya jayega. we won't brook this surreptitious pushing of rafidi aqaid.

    Allah ta'ala knows best. the speaker was saying what i wanted to say here.

    this is why young sunnis should read about aqaid from books of our glorious ulama in the past.

    nas'alu Allaha al-aafiyah.
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  13. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    a friend sent me this link. he was saying things i been saying:
    (i don't know about the speaker at all. first time seeing him, but i agree with what he is saying here)

    Unbeknown likes this.
  14. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    those who support irfan shah and his gali galoch are juhala even if they have degrees and wear two meter imamahs.
    plus on this mas'alah, anyone who is against jalali is not only wrong but embarrasses themselves that they have no clue of aqaid. their foolish and dumb murids may 'wah-wah' it today, but when people look back after a couple decades, they will be cancelled from the list of sunni ulama.

    that will be their destiny.

    irfan shah is cancelled. we won't be cowed by these silly threats of 'we are sayyids' when we demand proof for their claims.

    zulm has its consequences.
    dumb muridin may worship ahl e bayt.
    we only respect them until they are in line with the shariat of mustafa sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam.
    if they step out of line of ahl al-sunnah, we are not bound to keep silent.

    there is a distorted concept of 'respect' to the point that people hesitate to mention flagrant violations of the shariah. is irfan shah higher than the shariah of mustafa sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam?

    Allah ta'ala hates those who use foul language. this is the hadith of mustafa sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam.

    may Allah ta'ala humiliate the rafidis and give sense to their pawns among sunnis.

    these maulvis can only shout in majlis in front of gullible public and the sensible ones have to sit quiet - else the majority of juhala will kill them.
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2020
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  15. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    Allahu Akbar.

    inna lillahi wa inna ilayhi rajiun.

    when did this happen. i missed a lot of posts below.

    sub'HanAllah, i didn't know this for four days! and just saw the messages (even though i had posted some myself after the ones that discuss it).

    Last edited: Jul 25, 2020
  16. Aqdas

    Aqdas Staff Member

    Yes, point taken.
  17. Waqar786

    Waqar786 Veteran

    First one is irrelevant but yes the second 2 because it aids their propaganda. I also did not like what Mufti Sahib said about giving the preference to the kunya of Abu Qasim over Zahra ka baba because it entails comparison between Sayiduna Qasim and Sayida Fatima. That's not wise and can (and will be) misconstrued as if Mufti Sahib is preventing sunnis from using the term Zahra ka baba. Don't give them any more fuel for their propaganda against true sunnis

    It's an age of fake news and partisanship. It requires our sincere scholars to adopt more wisdom.
  18. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    Who are "those"?

    The open rafidi's?
    The open tafdilis?
    Or the taqiyyabaz of the rafidi's and tafdilis?

    If it is any Sunnis, what is their daleel for leveling an accusation of nasibiyat?
  19. Waqar786

    Waqar786 Veteran

    @Aqdas... Although I understand where mufti sahib is coming from in the first video, that is not how you address the issue. It is giving an open goal to those who accuse sunni of Nasabism. Need to be more wise than this. This won't solve the issue of hidden rifz but rather strengthen their hand.
  20. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    That struck me too. I guess they have the Hadith of the slave girl to rely on.

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