malm sultanpuri?

Discussion in 'Poetry' started by AbdalQadir, May 31, 2021.

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  1. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    is actually a place in india. here.
    and the current MP is the most vilest, worst kind of anti-muslim fascist.
  2. Unbeknown

    Unbeknown Senior Moderator

    ha ha - I missed it completely.
    I thought sultanpur was some place in Pakistan.
  3. Unbeknown

    Unbeknown Senior Moderator

    you got him - thanks for the heads up

    anyone who wants to know the real face of this shady person should watch this in full:

    brother Daniel has done an awesome job.

    I would like to see him grill hanson some day.

    also the person questioning brown in the podcast being analyzed by Daniel deserves a pat on the back - brown was left spluttering and towards the end even his "adab" mask fell off - he actually swore (in abbreviation) - like a truly arrogant shaytan that he is.

    also, I do not doubt any longer that yaqeen institute is a trojan horse for spreading fahhashi and deviance among western Muslims.

    May Allah ta'ala give them what they deserve.
  4. AMQadiri

    AMQadiri Seeker

    I'm not surprised that he would say such things given that he studied at a Deobandi madarasa and associates closely with Deobandis.
    Abdullah Ahmed likes this.
  5. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    i think AQ referred to MALM as 'sultanpuri' because of majruh sultanpuri's famous sheyr:

    main akela hi chala tha janib e manzil magar
    log saath aatey gaye aur karwaan banta gaya

    and razor punk birminghami signed off:


    i know it is obvious - but it is possible that people in the west not acquainted with urdu may miss the quip. pardon my bad habit of explaining the joke.
    Abdullah Ahmed and Unbeknown like this.
  6. Surati

    Surati Well-Known Member


    Interesting point. If only our Ulama would.
  7. Unbeknown

    Unbeknown Senior Moderator

    I am sorry if I keep sounding repetitive - but my point since the beginning of thrread has been that shaytanpuri is a bad use-case.
  8. Unbeknown

    Unbeknown Senior Moderator

    you have a point there - I just chanced upon daniel's podcast posted in the other thread.

    haven't watched this one. will check.

    maybe. you must adjust for the fact that I don't live in the west - I only know it through internet, books etc.

    lol - I did not mean that - in fact that is one reason I posted this video.

    that this is one way of being relatable without turning it into a circus show. they are working "with" the youth - or so it appears - at least not appealing to their nafsanic appetites like this shaytanpuri.

    it was only a coincidence that I noticed the person speaking so rashly about the Prophet (peace be upon him) - and I think that comes of letting the guard down in the name of being relatable.

    so basically, it's about drawing lines and striking a balance - and also, as I noted earlier, different people can focus on different subjects and age groups - and network among themselves about how best to reach as wide an audience as possible.
  9. Surati

    Surati Well-Known Member

    This is an overgeneralisation.

    Nay one is declaring dropeth the rev'rence and respect yond we needeth to showeth at which hour we talketh.

    If 't be true being relatable is not imp'rtant, wherefore don’t thee speaketh in fusty English? Thee might as well bark at those folk.
  10. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    if shadee is some sort of a supporter for yaqeen and jonathan brown, he's a more dangerous character than the jackass malm

    the difference between them would only be in andaze bayan, not in the actual substance of their jahalah.

    think of keller vs malm. for an average young guy with basic Islamic upbringing (at least in the east, even in our times), it would be very easy to write off malm but he could still fall for keller's shenanigans due to the purported adab and traditional talk.

    same case here for shadee vs malm (if really he's shady)

    do note that these malm, atabek, javed ghamdi kind of funky characters have only come up in the recent times owing to perhaps the twitter and youtube culture. until a few years back, even most deviants, for the most part, buried their deviancies under layers of eloquence, adab and "traditional knowledge".
  11. Unbeknown

    Unbeknown Senior Moderator

    These people are also working with the youth - and are probably authentic in their activities - unlike this sultanpuri snake.

    I feel they are actually trying to help youngsters like them - as they have been in the same boat and can empathize:

    To an extent they are doing fine. Dr. Shady starts off on a very beautiful note about surah mujadilah.

    But then, the draw backs of shallow learning gradually begin to surface - see what he says at around 14:00 - 16:00 mark!

    My point is that - if we become too off-handed, we risk crossing lines that were meant to be respected.

    The modern youth seems to have lost the sense of "awe" - how to speak when in presence of al-Jabbar, how to mention His Beloved (صلى الله عليه وسلم).

    The sahaba (رضي الله عنهم) would sit so still in the exalted majlis, that birds could alight on their heads without alarm.

    But the youth of today wants everything to be: "Oh man, cmmon, we are all friends, what's your problem - just chill ..."

    My intention is not to belittle the brother who said those words (given he is a revert and grew up in the toxic West) - moreover, shadee jumped in quickly and gently corrected him - but the point remains - that our language cannot be allowed to drop all weight - even when addressing a youthful audience.
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2021
  12. Umar99

    Umar99 Veteran

    He's a complete neychari, it's time we bring this term back and use for him and others like him such as javad hashmi.
  13. Unbeknown

    Unbeknown Senior Moderator

    so I am a bit late. I was procrastinating because I thought I would end up writing a long post.

    But this article posted by @AbdalQadir here saves me a bit of the extra work.


    Among the several things to a scholar needs to get across to people, some are, by nature, difficult to simplify - without ending up oversimplifying them.

    Now that article is not something that most teenagers would enjoy reading of an afternoon in the park.

    But can one say - "it's useless" - "what's the point of writing when only a few clever people will understand"?

    So an "academic" objection - especially a theological one - needs must be refuted in a like manner.

    Sh. Asrar (and others) are doing that - as much as is in their capacity. I have not read his book, but his lectures aren't so long-winded as all that.

    Now, let others take up the gauntlet of simplifying his ideas (or whoever's) for the youth and those dictionary brandishing adults.

    For example, mawlana shahid sahib is another one of our rising stars and he is good at explaining things.

    Sh. Asrar himself must have students capable of doing that.

    Then again, these same teenagers will eventually go on to study in academia and then they will probably not enjoy the "sweet and simple" language.

    As we grow, our experiences deepen and intellects expand, and so do our worries and doubts.

    An answer which we found satisfactory at age 15 may not be able to convince us at 30 or 35.

    Then we will complain that we do not have "intellectual" writers who "understand" the complexity of the issues that we face.

    In short, we must have both varieties - nay, a spectrum, in fact.

    Even among Ridawipress works, you will find some that require you to exercise your intellectual muscle - The Killer Mistake is definitely a classic work in its own right - and you will find some complex footnotes in Bad'il Amali too.

    But "Who is Alahazrat" or "The Wasaya of Alahazrat" are pretty lucid even for teens.

    I hope that I haven't repeated myself in so many words without advancing my argument at all - and haven't imputed to you something you did not mean.

    wa Allahu a'alam
  14. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    in that video, he very cleverly plants doubts, and uses reverse psychology by saying that we have inherited the christian/western understanding of jannah (so that people move away from the traditional understanding), and then somehow makes room for kufriya atheistic thoughts. notice how he emphasizes on the word "alcohol". looks like he's on his way to being a full fledged mirza qadiani.
  15. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    does this mardood believe that jannah and jahannam are just metaphors?

    if so, where are the fatwas of riddah on him?

  16. Unbeknown

    Unbeknown Senior Moderator

    @Surati while I agree with most of you have said I have a few observations to make later on. in sha Allah.
  17. Abdullah Ahmed

    Abdullah Ahmed Well-Known Member

    May be someone should write a Sharh on his book....:)
  18. Surati

    Surati Well-Known Member

    I’m baffled at this response. Are you saying that the ‘backward Indians’ don’t understand English and are not worth Sh. Asrar’s time? If that’s what you mean, then shame on you. A lot of youth in India have better command and master English more than the average youth here in the UK.

    Are you from the UK? It seems that you’re not familiar with the general language level of young people here.
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2021
  19. YaMustafa

    YaMustafa Well-Known Member


    You’re from India I assume. Surat perhaps?

    In which case I understand your point if your talking about the youth in surat.
  20. Surati

    Surati Well-Known Member


    At the end of the day, this religion is not for a few intellectual people only. Dumbing down is used as a pejorative term but if that is what is needed to reach the youth then why not?
    However, the logic should remain sound. Facts should be accurate. The language should be effective and clear. A difficult concept/idea can and must be explained in simple terms. The idea is to transmit information to everyone even the stupid people.

    If at the end of your bombastic explanation your audience only realises how good your vocabulary is or how very clever you are, then you have missed the point.

    The discussion was about his target audience, not about his topic maintenance.

    I am not saying that his talks are not informative or that we do not derive benefit from it. I personally enjoy his talks as many of us here but I wouldn’t classify myself as being the “youth”.

    I’m speaking for youngsters who have told me they want to listen to him or read his books him but find it tedious to do so.
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2021
    Chishti Nizami and Unbeknown like this.

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