Shayk Zafar Ahmad Usmani says in his Ileau us Sunan in the relevant chapter about pointing the finger in salah quoting from Al Azimabadi (Awn al Mabud 1/375), that Bayhaqi has recorded 2 evidenses for both Hanafi and Shafi i.e. one proof for Hanafis i.e. to point at ''la'' and lower at ''ill allah'' And one proof for Shafi i.e. to point when saying ''ill allah''....however Shayk Zafar Ahmad Usmani says; ''i have not come across these narrations because we dont have the Sunan and other books of Bayhaqi at the hand, if someone has them please pass them.'' So they have to be somewhere in Bayhaqi's books..i think they might be in Al Khilafiyaat as Bayhaqi listed there proofs for both Shafi and Hanafi.
jazakumAlahu khayran very nice notes i'd not come accross these ahadith before. this should be made into an article ;-)
indeed, it is in the text of nur al-eeDaH itself: yarfa'uha `inda'n nafiy wa yaD`uhaa `inda'l ithbaat the finger is raised at laa and dropped at illa Allah. nafiy means to negate - here negating partners to Allah by saying laa ilaaha and ithbat is to attest - here attesting by saying except Allah.
in the book raf'a at-taraddud fi `aqad al-aSabiy `inda't tashahhud by ibn abidin shami [removing the hesitation about curling fingers in tashahhud] these are not contiguous quotes. this monograph is included in rasayil ibn abidin volume 1/pg.120 onwards. the takmilah starts on page 130. ---- [describing shafiyi position] reported by muslim from ibn `umar raDiyallahu anhuma that when RasulAllah sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam sat for the tashahhud, he placed his left hand on the left knee and the right hand upon the right knee and he clasped his fingers in the shape of fifty three and made a sign with his index finger. [fifty three: if you make a circle with your thumb and forefinger, it is like the arabic numeral 5 and the three clasped fingers are 3; thus like 53.] ----- as for us, [hanafis] we take the report of tirmidhi narrated by wayil about the Salah of RasulAllah sallallahu alayhi wa sallam: when he sat for the tashahhud, his stretched [laid flat/iftarasha] his left foot and put his left palm upon the left thigh; and planted his right foot [upon the toes]" without adding anymore. and the meaning of muslim's narration is that, he [Sallallahu alayhi wa sallam] curled the fingers just before he made the sign, not kept them curled during the entire tashahhud. do you not see, in another narration of muslim: "he placed his right palm on his right thigh and clasped all his fingers [as a fist] and and made a sign with the finger next to the thumb" there is no doubt that the intial placing of his palm was not by clasping his fingers; rather it means, that he placed his palm [with straightened fingers] and then clasped them when he had to make the sign. ---- in the appendix of the aforementioned risalah, ibn abidin quotes ali al-qari from his risalah: 'taz-yeen al-`ibarah li taHseen al-`isharah' [beautifying an essay, commending the sign] and particularly the hadith of wayil ibn Hujr raDiyallahu anhu and says: according to the majority of scholars he made one sign at the time of uttering the witness [`inda'l jamhur waqt ash-shahadah] and according to imam malik, he made the sign many times from the start of the tashahhud until the last. narrated by abu dawud, nasayi and ad-darimi. --- the question about the time of making the sign is found in numerous hadith and it is described in the words da`a or yad`u; which actually means when he utters the kalimah laa ilaa illaa Allah. in hadith 907 from mishkat: a hadith reported by muslim. when he sallallahu `alayhi wa sallam sat during salah, he placed his both hands on both knee and raised his right [fore]finger that is adjacent to the thumb and then do tahlil, and his left hand on the left knee. ali al-qari explains this in its sharH mirqat: [yad`uu] in another copy fa-yad'uu meaning uttering the tahlil; tahlil and taHmid are termed as du'a because they are in the place of soliciting the Favor of Allah, most High. ---- hadith 989 in abu dawud: narrated by `abdullah ibn zubayr: that he mentioned that Nabiy sallallahu `alayhi wa sallam would make a sign by his finger when he made dua [that is, said laa ilaaha illa Allah] and would not keep gesturing. [annahu dhakara anna'n nabiyy sallallahu `alayhi wa sallam kaana yusheeru bi-iSba`yihi idh da`aa wa laa yuHarrikuhaa] ---- aH: tahlil is saying: laa ilaaha illaa Allah and taHmid is saying: alHamdulillah --- inshaAllah, i will give the other references from hadith. Allah ta'ala knows best.
could you kindly post the hadith where this is specifically mentioned jazakumAllahu khayran if not hadith then any reports from the companions, etc in support of the specific method of the ahnaf?
I have heard during a dars on Allama Shurunbulali's Nur-ul-Idha that the preferred position is to drop the finger at "illallah". I am not sure if this is explicitly stated in Nur-ul-Idha or it was simply a commentary by the speaker on the text.
As-salamu 'alaykum Sidi Faqir, I have not come through any Qur'an verse or hadith about the precise time of raising the finger, rather in hadith it is said at the time of shahadat. But, I know very well, that almost all muslims raise their finger (and many moves it etc), so maybe you can tell me then where they did acquire this knowledge (about when it should be raised exactly, and not just "at shahadat") - especially those who does not follow any fiqh, but just Qur'an and hadith, they must have some ahadith about the topic, that I do not know. I hope you can help me finding the ahadith? Otherwise, I think the slogan "Qur'an and hadith only" maybe need som reconsiderings Allah Hafiz Ibn Amin
i cannot find in the qur'an the times of obligatory salaH. and there are dozens of things which i can't find in Hadith even. can you help?
As-salamu 'alaykum By scriptual evidences do you mean from Qur'an and hadith only, or will it do from hanafi fiqh works also? Allah Hafiz Ibn Amin
jazakumAllahu khayran what i've not been able to find to date is any scriptural evidence for the time to raise and drop the finger in the tashahud according to the ahnaf. if sh. sa'idi has provided any hadith in this regard could you please post it here.
raising the finger is the preferred position whereas some Hanafi fuqaha advised against it [and their evidence was to not turn the limbs away from the qiblah]. however, it is proven from the hadith and among the latter hanafis both ibn abidin and alahazrat have advocated it and did not accept the ruling of those who opposed it. ibn abidin wrote a monograph rafa'a at-taraddud on this subject which also examines different ways of raising this finger. - some say you should not move at all - some say that you should clasp three fingers and keep the tip of the thumb on the tip of the index finger; and raise it at 'laa' and drop after the name of Allah. [similar to shafiyis and malikis] - some say that you should leave them open and just lift the index finger during the kalimah and the chosen position from various of hanafi resources is that which is narrated from imam abu ja'afar [at-Tahawi?] that you should leave the fingers open and just before you say laa, clasp the last two fingers within the palm; make a circle with the tip of of the thumb and the middle finger and then raise the index finger. after the saying of the name of Allah you drop the finger. --- some people say that the fingers should be curled from the beginning itself, which imam shami does not accept; also, he says that the right hand should be left in the state that was when you dropped the finger because, no change of further state is mentioned. however, bahar e shariat suggests to straighten the fingers and i suppose the reasoning is derived on two counts: - one of the positions was that of straightened fingers and palm and by going back to that state, we have acted on both positions. - second, the hikmah of curling the toes or placing the palms on the thighs while standing up from sajdah [vide radd al muHtar] instead of clasping the knees is said to be that we should try to keep the limbs facing the qiblah as much as possible. so, when you are done with acting upon the sunnah of raising the finger, it is better to keep them in a state that is recommended by the fuqaha - to keep limbs towards the qiblah. anyway, it is a mustaHabb action proven from sunnah. Allah ta'ala knows best.
As-salamu 'alaykum The respected shaykh proves the validity of raising the finger. Allah Hafiz Ibn Amin
ibn abidin himself - raDiyallahu anhu - advocated the practise of raising the finger in his epistle: raf'a at-taraddud and followed it with an appendix summing ali al-qari's position. in fact, in radd al-muHtar he criticizes the position of some Hanafi ulama who objected to it.
As-salamu 'alaykum It is the position of Imam Rabbani, Mujaddid Alf Thani, Imam Ahmad Sirhindi (rahimahullah) that the finger should not be raised, therefore most naqshbandis do not, but according to the majority of the 'ulama of ahnaf (Hashiya Ibn 'Abidin, Bahar-e-Shariat, Fatawa Ridwiyyah, Nur al-Idah etc.) it is sunnat to raise the index finger. Shaykh al-Hadith Allama Ghulam Rasul Sa'idi has written a lengthy discussion about this in Sharh Sahih Muslim. Allah Hafiz Ibn Amin
There are many hadiths saying that it is permissible to make a sign with one's index finger. Some of the savants of the Hanafi Madhhab have said so, too. Mawlana 'Alimullah states so, too. If the books in the Hanafi Madhhab are read with attention, it will be seen that the pieces of knowledge communicating that it is permissible to raise one's finger are not from the knowledge of usul. They are not the madhhab's zahir khabars. Imam-i Muhammad Shaibani said, "Our Prophet 'sallAllahu alaihi wa sallam' used to make a sign with his blessed finger. Like him, we, too, raise and lower our finger. Imam-i azam Abu Hanifa said so, too." But it has been communicated through nawadir information, not through usul information, that Imam-i Muhammad said so. [Ibni Abidin writes on the forty-seventh page of his first volume, "Information of the Hanafi Madhhab reached the later savants through three different ways: 1 - Those pieces of information which are usul are also called zahir khabars. These are the pieces of information coming from Imam-i azam Abu Hanifa and his disciples. These pieces of information are communicated in Imam-i Muhammad's six books. These six books are Al-Mabsut, Az-Ziyadat, Al-Jami'ussaghir, As-Siyarus saghir, Al-Jami'ulkabir and As-Siyarulkabir. Because these books were brought from Imam-i Muhammad by trustworthy people, they are called zahir khabars. Who gathered the pieces of usul information together first is Hakim Shahid [Muhammad]. His book Kafi is well-known. There are many books explaining Kafi. 2 - Those pieces of information that are nawadir, also come from these same savants. But these pieces of information do not exist in those six books, but they exist in Imam-i Muhammad's other books titled Al-Qisaniyyat, Al-Haruniyyat, Al-Jurjaniyyat and Ar- Ruqiyyat. Because these four books were not brought clearly and dependably as the former six books were, these pieces of information are called 'information which is not zahir.' Or they are reported in others' books. For example, they are reported in the book Muharrar by Hasan bin Ziyad, one of Imam-i azam's disciples, or in Imam-i Abu Yusuf's Amali. 3 - Those pieces of information which are waqi'at. These pieces of information were not communicated by the three imams, but are those matters on which their disciples or the disciples of their disciples performed ijtihad. Abullays-i Samarqandi who gathered these pieces of information first, wrote the book Nawazil." Ibni Abidin, again, writes on the thirty-fifth page of his first volume, "The knowledge of fiqh is as indispensable for everybody as food is. Abdullah ibni Masud 'radiAllahu anh', who sowed the seeds of this knowledge, was one of the greatest and best learned ones of the Sahaba. Alqama, his disciple, watered these seeds and turned them into crops, and Ibrahim Nahai, his disciple, reaped the harvest, that is, gathered the pieces of this knowledge together. Hammad-i Kufi threshed it, and his disciple, Imam-i azam Abu Hanifa, ground it, that is, he classified the knowledge into sections; Abu Yusuf made dough from it, and Imam-i Muhammad baked it. Muslims have been eating the morsels prepared in this procedure. In other words, learning this knowledge they have been attaining happiness in this world and the next. Imam-i Muhammad communicated these morsels which he baked in nine hundred and ninety-nine branches of knowledge to his disciples. Of his six books, in the ones which he called saghir (little), he communicated what he learned through Imam-i Abu Yusuf, and, in those which he called kabir, he communicated only what he heard from Imam-i azam." It is for this reason that the book Siyar-i kabir, which is a work of Imam-i Muhammad's, does not contain Imam-i Abu Yusuf's name. Today, some ignorant people who do not know of this subtle information impute this to his antipathy against Imam-i Abu Yusuf. However, these two imams were in the highest grade of hubb-i fillah. Even those who follow in their footsteps get rid of the desires of their nafs owing to them.] The book Fatawa-i gharaib informs that it is written in the book Muhit: "Imam-i Muhammad did not communicate in his books of usul that one must make a sign with the pointing finger of one's right hand. Also, those savants who succeeded him said differently on the subject. There were those who said that one should not as well as those who said that one should. Imam-i Muhammad, in his books other than books of usul, writes that the Prophet 'sallAllahu alaihi wa sallam' used to make a sign with his finger and communicates that Imam-i azam also informed of this fact. As it is said that it is sunnat to make a sign, there are those who say that it is mustahab." The book Fatawa-i gharaib then adds: "In actual fact, it is haram to do so." It is written in Fatawa-i sirajiyya, "It is makruh to raise the finger when saying 'ash hadu an la...' in namaz. The book Kubra affirms this. Savants agree about this. The fatwa has been given in agreement with this, too. For, it is necessary to sit calmly, without moving in namaz." It is written in the book of fatwa titled Ghiyasiyya [as well as in the book Bazaziyya], "One should not make a sign with one's pointing finger during the sitting posture. This is what the fatwa says. And this is what has been preferred, liked." It is written in the book Jami'ur-rumuz. "One should not make a sign or bend one's finger. This is so according to the teachings of usul of the Madhhab. It is written so in Zahidi's book, too. The fatwa also has been given in agreement with this. Also, it is written so in the books Mudmarat, Walwaljiyya, Khulasa and others. Some of our superiors, on the other hand, state that it is sunnat to make a sign with the finger." [The book Jami'ur-rumuz is an explanation of the book Nikaya, which, in its turn, is an abridged edition of the book Wikaya. The book Mudmarat is an explanation of the book Quduri.] The book Hazinaturriwayat, citing from the book Tatarhaniyya, says, "While sitting for the tashahhud and saying 'la ilaha il-lal-lah,' will the pointing finger of the right hand make a sign? Imam-i Muhammad did not mention this in the information of usul. Those who came after him said differently on this matter. Some savants said that one should not make a sign. So does the book Kubra write. The fatwa agrees with this, too. Yet some others said that one should make a sign." Hazinat-ur-riwayat is a book of fiqh written by the Qadi of Gujarat in India. Kubra, a book of fatwa, was written by Husamaddin 'Umar. It is written in Durr-ul- mukhtar, "One should not make a sign with one's pointing finger when saying the word of shahadat in namaz. The fatwa says so. It is written so in Walwaljiyya, in Tajnis, in UmdatulMufti, and in all the books of fatwa. But those who annotated these books, such as Kamal, Halabi, Baqani, say, 'One will make a sign. As a matter of fact, Imam-i Muhammad informed that Rasulullah 'sallAllahu alaihi wa sallam' used to do so.' Also, it is written in the book Muhit that it is sunnat to make a sign." Ibni Abidin says, "It is understood from Muhit that it is sunnat-i ghayr-i muakkada. As a matter of fact, Ayni and Tuhfa inform that it is mustahab." In the book Nur-ul-izah, Sharnblali says, "What is sahih is to make a sign with one's pointing finger," and Tahtawi objects to this. As it is seen, there are savants who say that it is haram to make the sign. There are fatwas informing that it is makruh. There are many who say that one does not make the sign; information of usul states so. Then, it is not right for us, the imitators, to attempt to make the sign by saying that there is a hadith confirming it, thus doing something which has been said to be haram or makruh by the fatwas of many mujtahids. If a person in the Hanafi Madhhab makes the sign with his finger despite the fatwas informing that it is prohibited, this denotes one of two opinions: 1 - It may come to mean that he thinks these savants of din who reached the grade of ijtihad did not know of the mashhur hadiths informing that one will make the sign with one's finger. 2 - Or it means that he thinks that they heard of the hadiths but did not follow the hadiths and acted upon their own thoughts and opinions. Both these opinions are quite eccentric. To suppose so, one should be very mean and quite obstinate. Also, the word, "Early savants used to make a sign with their fingers in namaz. Afterwards, Rafidis overflowed the measure in doing this, so the savants of Hanafi prohibited the Ahl as-sunnat from making the sign. Thus, the Sunnis were distinguished from the Rafidis," in the book Targhibussalat, is incompatible with the information in valuable books. For, our savants inform through (the branch of religious knowledge termed) zahir usul not to make the sign or bend the finger. That is, the early savants said not to make the sign. Then, this matter has nothing to do with the Rafidis. Since some of our religious superiors said that one should not make the sign, what devolves on us is to respect them, to mind our manners and say: "If these superiors had not had the documentary evidence showing that it would be haram or makruh to make a sign with the finger, they would not say that it would be haram or makruh. After communicating the reports informing that it is sunnat or mustahab to make the sign, they would not say, 'Though they have said so, the truth of the matter is that the sign is haram.' This means that maybe they inferred that not those pieces of information communicating that the sign was sunnat or mustahab, but those evidences showing that it was prohibited were right." In short, we ignorant people having heard a few hadiths cannot be a witness or a document. It cannot be a reason for our refuting the words of the superiors of the din. One may say, "We now have obtained the information showing that what they inferred was wrong." Yet the information which we ignorant people have cannot be a witness for something to be halal or haram. Something can be halal or haram only after a mujtahid's determining it to be. It would be critically daring to consider mujtahids' words and evidences to be more flimsy than a spider's web. It would be to inflict a deep wound on Islam to hold one's own knowledge superior to the knowledge of the superiors of the din, to say that the usul information of the Hanafi Madhhab is corrupt and unsound, to hold of no account the valuable information which the savants depend upon in giving fatwa and to say that this information is wrong. Islam's great savants, being closer to the brilliant time of Rasulullah 'sallallahu alaihi wa sallam', their knowledge being very much more than that of those who came after them, and because they avoided sins and feared Allahu ta'ala to the greatest extent, would know and understand the hadiths certainly better than we addle- headed and ignorant people do, who know nothing of knowledge of the din and who boast of a few words which we heard in the name of knowledge. They would distinguish the right ones from the wrong ones, the changed ones from the unchanged ones better than we can. Certainly, they must have had some reasons for saying that these hadiths should not be followed, and there must have been some sound witnesses which they depended upon. We, who are so inferior to them in knowledge and in sight, understand to the extent that there are various hadiths explaining how to bend the finger, but they do not agree with one another. This incoherence among the (reported) hadith ash-Sharifs has made it difficult to say something definite on whether or not to make the sign. Some reports say that the sign should be made without bending fingers into the form of a fist, while others say that it should be made by bending them likewise. Some of those who say that fingers should be bent inform that it should be done by representing the figure as fifty-three. And others say that they will be bent in such a manner as to represent the figure twenty-three. [While explaining these, Halabi describes at full length how to show figures with the fingers.] Some other reports say that one should close one's two little fingers on the right, form a circle with one's thumb and middle finger and make the sign with one's pointing finger. Another report says that the sign will be made by putting one's thumb on one's middle finger. Some narration says that the sign should be made by putting one's right hand on one's left thigh and one's left hand on one's right foot. Another report says that the sign will be made by putting the right hand, together with the wrist and the arm, on the left hand, wrist and arm. To some reports, the sign will be made by closing all the fingers, while others inform that it will be made without moving the pointing finger. In addition to these, it is said that the sign will be made during the tahiyyat, but not a certain place is given, and, in some other information, it is said that the sign will be made when saying the word shahadat. And some other reports inform that when sitting to pray one should say, "O My Allah, Thou canst change the hearts as Thou wilt! Keep my heart steady in Thine din!" and make the sign while saying so. The savants of the Hanafi Madhhab, seeing that the hadiths uttered on the sign were numerous and various, said not to do any action incompatible with the clear and definite commandments about namaz. For, it is essential in namaz to avoid any extra movements and to perform it in a solemn attitude. Furthermore, as it is declared by all the savants unanimously, it is sunnat to do one's best to keep one's fingers pointing towards the qibla all the time. It is ordered openly by the hadith: "During namaz do your best to keep all your limbs pointing towards the Qibla!" Should it be suggested, "Those hadiths having been uttered differently will make the matter difficult only when they cannot be reconciled with one another. But a common rule can be deduced from these hadiths. For, various hadiths may have been heard and reported at different times," we would say in response that many of these reports contain the word 'kana' (was), which comes to mean 'all,' in the branches of knowledge other than logic. For this reason, these various reports cannot be reconciled. Imam-i azam Abu Hanifa said, "If you learn a hadith which disagrees with my word, give up my word and follow the hadith;" yet this statement of his was about those hadiths which he had not heard. He meant to say, 'Give up any of my words which disagrees with a hadith that I have not heard.' However, the hadiths about making the sign are not so; they are well- known, they are widespread. It cannot be said that Imam-i azam might have not heard them. [Imam-i azam said so to his own disciples, that is, to mujtahids, not to us ignorant people.] In case of a question such as, "Among the savants of the Hanafi, there are also those who said that the sign should be made and who gave a fatwa in agreement with this. Isn't it permissible to follow any one of the fatwas disagreeing with one another?" We would answer that when the disagreement between fatwas is in the manner of 'permissible, not permissible, or halal, haram,' it is essential to follow those fatwas which say 'not permissible or haram.'
