Whose Qualities are these?

reason gave for what?

about the 'karim' definition? if so, how?

 

And I am slower then you ...besides I dont even have the vocab

What was the reason Alahazrat gave?

 

still not clear. what are you saying that is 'similar'?

apologies for being slow.

 

Brother what was the intended meaning/commentary of this couplet?

No, as mentioned earlier, he sallallahu alaihi wa sallam is karim.
The similarity between the impermissibility of calling our Prophet (sallallahu alaihi wa sallam) 'alim ul ghaib' whilst knowing the ghaib and what I am saying is found in the reason for the prohibition

 

incidentally, i left that out, as it is one of the subtle ones.

are you saying you cannot call him 'karim'? صلى الله عليه وسلم

 

May Allaah reward you

Whilst I consider these posts, its worth mentioning that from famous Alahazrat's works the line 'sacha dene wala hai hamara Nabi' is also against me, whilst his position on the impermissibility of calling the Prophet sallallahu alaihi wa alihi wa sallam 'alim ul ghaib' (whilst knowing the Ghaib) supports my view

 

in the burdah:

نَبِيُّنَا الآمِرُ النَّاهِي فَلاَ أَحَدٌ
أَبَرَّ فيِ قَوْلِ لاَ مِنْهُ وَلاَ نَعَم

abarra fi qawli laa minhu wa laa na'ami.
he is far removed from saying 'no'.
​

which alahazrat has said thus:

waah kya juud o karam hai shah e baT'Haa tera
'nahiN' sun'ta hi nahiN maaNgne waala teraa​

---
in fact, there is a hadith in SaHiHayn that means the above: [below from bukhari, #6034]

 

----
the above need not be absolute; nor that all 6 propositions are valid at all times. nor does it have the meaning of 'istighraq' - i.e. all the six proposition hold true in each and every case. there are many such lines one can object to based on layman's approach below:

to wit.

​

1. Gives whatever is asked for:

maaNg man manti munh maaNgi muradeN lega
na yahaN naa hai na mangta se ye kahna kya hai.​

waah kya juud o karam hai shah e baT'Haa tera
nahiN sun'ta hi nahiN maaNgne waala teraa​

hum bhikari woh karim, un ka khuda un sey fuzuN
aur naa kahna nahin aadat RasulAllah ki (sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam)​

2. Gives when you ask

mangtaa kaa haath uTh'tey hi daata ki deyn thi
doori qabul o arz meiN bas haath bhar ki hai

un ke nisaar koyi kayse hi ranj meiN ho
jab yaad aa gaye haiN sab gham bhula diye haiN

mu'min huN mu'minoN pe ra'uf o raHim ho
sayil huN saayiloN ko khushi 'laa nahar' ki hai​

3. Gives however much you ask for

maangeNge maaNge jayeNge muNh maaNgi paayeN ge
sarkar mein na 'laa' hai na haajat 'agar' ki hai

do jahaN ki behtariyaN nahiN ke amani e dil o jaaN nahiN
kaho kya hai woh jo yahaN nahiN magar ik nahiN, ke woh haaN, 'nahin'.

jo chahe un se maang ke donoN jahaN ki khayr
zar-na-kharidah ek kaneez un ke ghar ki hai
​

4. Gives more than you need:

mere karim se gar qaTrah kisi ne maanga
dariya baha diye haiN durbe baha diye haiN​

aage rahi aTa woh ba qadr e Talab to kya
aadat yahaN ummeed se bhi beeshtar ki hai

be maange dene waale ki niymat mein gharq hain
maange se jo mile kise fahm us qadar ki hai​

5. Gives all the time:

karim aysa mila ke jis ke khule haiN haath aur bharey khazane
bataO ay mufliso ke phir kyuN tumhara dil iztirab meiN hai

haath jis samt uTha ghani kar diya
mawj e baHr samaHat pey lakhoN salam
​

6. Gives to everyone:

luTf un kaa aam ho hi jaayega
shaad har naa kaam ho hi jaayega

barasta nahiN dekh kar abr e raHmat
badoN par bhi barsa de barsa ne waaley

tishna e nahr e jinaN har arabi o ajami
lab e har nahr jinaN tishna e neesan e arab

khalq ke Haakim ho tum, rizq e qasim ho tum
tum se mila jo mila, tum pe karoroN durud

najdi us ne tujh ko muhlat di ke is aalam meiN hai
kaafir o murtad pey bhi raHmat RasulAllah ki (sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam)

​

====

perhaps we are over-reacting...

 

as layman says, if you take poetry literally, there can be many objections:

one is that Allah as al-Karim cannot be included in this definition. as the brother pointed out that Allah ta'ala does not give everything to everyone who asks:




besides there is explicit aayat that some things are withheld for some:




in another verse:



---
another is that, this 'karim' excludes prophets salawatullahi alayhim. besides RasulAllah sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam said:

bukhari, #6615:




====
however, in a lengthy discussion on the Divine Name al-Karim, qurtubi says in his al-asna something that is similar to the urdu lines quoted.



---
wAllahu a'alam.

 

I complained to the Imam of the Masjid where i saw this on the front wall (infront) of the namazis. He said it was fine, the words could be interpreted if you do this and that. Like ignore requests which are against shariah, and remember when everyone is mentioned everyone is not included. I pointed out that his points were against the spirit of other couplets. For example the spirit of this description does not leave room for exceptions because it says 'Jo Mango' and 'har kissee ko dai'

I also said it denies Prophethood because if one is not given they'd be forced to conclude the person is not kareem (Astagfirullah)


I told him I believe in tawassul and istighatha and that Prophet SallAllahu alaihi wa alihi wa sallam is indeed Kareem and that the problem is the wording of these couplets but he wasn't impressed, and denied it was wrong. He was willing to explain each portion to me, but I said the whole thing is wrong and does not even fit Allaah (because Allaah does not grant every requested thing but often gives something else like reward thereby going against the couplet). He said Allaah is above that, I said the couplet is not expressing our Aqeedah correctly and the zahiri (and batin) readings of the couplet is wrong. Plain wrong.

Even if we read it in a way that is favourable to the couplet, the spirit of it is against the Sunnah. I said it was fisq and certainly not worthy of being displayed in the manner done.
He felt it deserved to be read in the manner intended. I felt it was just wrong especially when it requires so many exceptions to be made and it was displayed to the lay people like myself

I left it at that and said my job was to just point out its possible incorrectness and it was upto the Imam sahib and his people on what action they took


Knowledgeable brother, with great ahklaq


I'll go back in a couple of weeks and see if it is still displayed. I expect it to be still there

 

Query relates to this image

 

He is Generous only who
Gives whatever is asked for
Gives when you ask
Gives however much you ask for
Gives more then you need
Gives anytime
Gives to everyone



Who do all these qualities belong to?