Why was Shaykh Hamza Yusuf refuted on Dante? | Shaykh Asrar Rashid

Discussion in 'Multimedia' started by Noori, May 4, 2015.

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  1. Noori

    Noori Senior Moderator

    jazakAllahu khayra.
  2. Aqib alQadri

    Aqib alQadri Veteran

  3. Noori

    Noori Senior Moderator

    thank you but i cannot watch it because i can't ccess youtube. can someone upload it on 4shared?
    has shaykh asrar's speech been uploaded
  4. Aqdas

    Aqdas Staff Member

    first post of this thread.
  5. Noori

    Noori Senior Moderator

    has shaykh asrar's speech been uploaded
  6. Ghulam

    Ghulam Veteran

    Mark giving Waheed a kiss

    Attached Files:

  7. Wadood

    Wadood Veteran

    i am not surprised and definitely none of you brothers are either. These ideas have been the position of hamza yusuf, habib ali, jihad brown (Mr Kellers student), and bin bayyah as far i can remember. i have sat face to face with them, and they teach such things in private gatherings everywhere. it is the very purpose behind the Lampost website by Abdullah Hamid Ali and Sherman Jackson. Tabah institute in the UAE was formed to propagate the new era.

    Ali Gomaa and Suhaib Webb have joined the team since 2009. Yasir Qadhi joined recently. Dr Tahir knows them.

    These are the modernist reformers of Islam today. Will Mr Keller add them to a new edition of his recent book on islamic reformers. They surely saturate the air with the stench of manure for miles like the farmers tilling their fields for summer crops not hard to notice.
    Ghulam Ali likes this.
  8. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    so will mark hanson and his teacher bin boya also advocate support for promiscuousness, homosexuality, adultery, premarital sex, booze, pop culture etc as well? he can rest assured he will attract a lot of people to his newly founded dajjalic religion. if the speech is authentically his, this zindiq is an ugly murtad and mustahiq al-la3nah.

    going by some of the comments in facebook, it seems like mark hanson's own fans are bewildered and shocked. few more speeches like that, and this pathetic vermin will himself spell the doom of his fame and riches.

    the suspension itself fell within the framework of the Shari3ah and the power vested by the Shari3ah in the Ameerul Mumineen. if this zindiq is a jahil mutlaq, it is not Muslims' or the Shari3ah's fault.
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2015
  9. Ghulam

    Ghulam Veteran



    Hamza Yusuf

    1 hr ·

    “So people take the revelation and think it is universally applicable in every time and place,” added Sheikh Hamza Yusuf, a renowned Muslim personality and president of Zaytuna College.

    “For example, Omar bin Al Khattab suspended [the Sharia penalty] for theft during drought.”

    Another example is the apostasy law, which used to be a universal principle and the general mentality of people at that time that leaving one’s religion is a capital offence punished by death, which existed in Christianity also.

    “That was to protect the religion … but it is no longer the mentality for the age we live in, so when you look at the universal principle of Islam it is to attract people towards religion.” However, he said, in the current age applying apostasy law will cause more people to leave religion than to join it so it has an opposite effect.

    As for other Sharia penalties, specialised scholars need to sit and think about them: “It all needs to be reassessed,” he added.
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 30, 2015
  10. Ghulam

    Ghulam Veteran

    There is the above in Canada by IIM in the form of Maulvi Nasheens and awards
  11. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    from what i have seen of america, scattered all over the various local mosques and community centers, but they will be silent achievers with no youtube channels of their own or google page rankings.

    as i said on another thread - thankfully, america's a huge country and real life is different to the hyped up world of the internet where idiots are called shaykhs and magnified 1000x.

    i'm not saying there's no problem. i'm just saying that it looks much more magnified on the internet.

    think about it. if that article on this thread is anything to go by, all mark hanson has is 50 students. sure that's 50 students too many, but seeing some of the likes on facebook, youtube and so on, we might be led to think that mark hanson's the salahuddin of north america, in terms of popularity.

    yes these people may occasionally fill up auditoriums of sheeple, but thankfully most common people are awed by good oratory more than substance, which is certainly not very good, but still reassuring for someone who is worried about common people saving their iman. do a check yourself. pull aside a random person and ask them what EXACTLY have they taken away from an ris talk by hanson (or any other speaker), and i can assure you at least 70% wouldn't be able to relay more than the catchy headline/title of some idiot's talk!

    the media and the internet are nothing but a giant heap of lies, hype and exaggerations illa ma sha Allah a few remote spots here and there.
  12. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    the wahabis have been right on mark hanson all along. too bad a lot of Sunnis as well as perennialists never took them seriously only because they are wahabis. can't blame the Sunnis too coz when they (wahabis) refute the likes of jifry, they club together all issues like love of khomeini and the pope and istighatha all under one refutation.

    for most baptized, perennialist sufis, for the most part the wahabis have been on the ball in refuting them inasmuch as perennialism and baptism of Muslim "shuyukh" is concerned - their usual diatribes against standard Ash3ari 3aqaid and tawassul, tabarruk, and istighatha are nothing specifically against the baptized sufis but rather against Sunnis overall, and have been refuted even before these young lads were born or supposedly converted.

    wahabis did support keller on his imkan al-kadhib issue due to their mad literalism, and this was refuted here - https://sunnianswers.wordpress.com/2011/08/23/744/ (it addresses the so called daleel the wahabis gave in support of keller).

    just remember that when money talks the same wahabis and baptized sufis happily join hands and deliver talks together (like yasir qadhi and faraz rabbani getting all chummy, and many other examples).
  13. Hashim Aftab

    Hashim Aftab New Member

    This is hugely concerning. That they do not see the enormity (and resultant repercussions) of the blasphemy of the work itself, or HY's endorsement of it, is beyond belief. Employing such hidebound mentalities in the long run will lead to the very real possibility of Sunni creed being transmogrified. Allāh protect us.

    Something needs to change in North America - what do you think is the cause of this passive attitude of laymen towards such serious issues? Where are the Asrars of North America?

    Indeed. And may Allāh forever grant him success in his endeavours.
  14. Wadood

    Wadood Veteran

    HY was refuted publicly by wahabis in the US. He ignored them always. But his students were responsive on multiple levels, usually in patronizing the wahabis. i was there with them.

    in conversation with common followers or admirers, i find that they dont see at all the enormity of the blasphemy found in Dante Inferno. They think of it as a literary work. nothing serious, they dont need HY to think that way. it is the education.

    Shaykh Asraar Rashid message is deep down for the Sunni cause. for every Muslim
  15. Hashim Aftab

    Hashim Aftab New Member

    ... which is why I said there was never going to be a response, and thus a one-way venture on Asrar's part. The deafening silence from Zaytuna/Sandala screams out leftfield rhetoric.
  16. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    are you serious?

    acknowledging or responding to the likes of Asrar Rasheed would be shooting himself in the foot! his safest bet is avoiding a confrontation, and he can only do that if he pretends he doesn't even know what's going on against him.

    unless you're a professional heavyweight yourself, would you get in the ring facing deontay wilder? you know you'd be creamed beyond recognition!

    the way of the heretics and zanadiqah is to make wild claims and then disappear! how many times have you heard of wahabis or deobandis challenging Sunnis to open munazara? barring a countable few times when a foolish one or two of them accepted a challenge from Sunnis and got thoroughly humiliated, mostly they don't even show up if and when a Sunni ever challenged them.

    have a look at this very forum and see how people like nawazuddin disappear the very moment proofs are solicited!

    responding or acknowledging would be as the hindi saying goes - sher ke munh mein haath daalna!

    purely from a duniyawi game of chess point of view, the best hamza can ever do to spread his kufr is not address the matter and keep stalling it till he dies, and then when he dies, his blind followers will sing qaseedas about how he was so brave and patient to not lend an ear to his detractors. then some 20 years after his death when the issue is obscure to the generation that comes after, a part 2 of the muhannad will be issued from zaytuna.

    this is how these things generally progress if history is anything to go by.

    of course hamza's zandaqa and fitnah could die too and become defunct with him or go dormant for a few deacdes till it rises again. this too has happened in history with heretics.


    but as a shaykh told me:

    'things are only going to get much more WORSE! you're seeing only the tip of the iceberg! if you think it's a challenge for you to protect your iman, it will be twice as hard for your children. make sure you teach your children imaniyaat and Sunniyat from a very young age, with as much proofs as required and make sure they are cemented in the manhaj of the Ahlus Sunnah and can defend their faith and creed full well. pray to Allah profusely to protect yours and your children's faiths. dajjaliyat and fitnah will spread more and more.'

    things aren't going to get any better till Imam Mehdi's zuhoor.
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2015
  17. Wadood

    Wadood Veteran

    Brother Aqdas, i would like you to know that the British Muslims, including those who follow Hamza Yusuf, do not really understand him and his North American students. There is a clash of mind-sets, worldviews. People from the UK, i find them more straightforward. The americans and canadians are different. The previous acknowledgement wasnt substantial either. The message has to reach shaykh hamza at home by someone local to prompt a real response, probably an angry one.

    Here in North America, Shaykh Asrar is not known at all. i could post his lecture on forums and blogs that are frequented and see what they think.
  18. Hashim Aftab

    Hashim Aftab New Member

    Well, apart from HY's so-called retraction over a year ago, his engagement of this discussion has been tacit at best. Asrar has been active in making the position of the Ahl al-Sunnah known, but sadly, and perhaps regrettably for HY, he has not even as little as bat an eyelid in response or acknowledgement.
  19. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    what you mean?
  20. Hashim Aftab

    Hashim Aftab New Member

    There hasn't been a reply; in fact, there was never going to be a reply. Due credit to Asrar, but this (unfortunately) has been a one-way venture.

    Glass half full: at least this has raised further awareness surrounding HY's controversies, and that in itself can only be a good thing - especially if the youth take heed and learn to guard their faith as a result.

    And success is from Allāh.
    Haqbahu likes this.

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