Ashique Mustafa
New Member
This thread is still incomplete
imam ibn fuurak / error of mufti ashraf jalali
- Thread starter abu Hasan
- Start date
abu Hasan
Administrator
salam. with so many open threads, i tend to lose track, even as i resist temptation to get involved in other threads...
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so let us restart this one.
but there are a few key pieces in between we need to know about to appreciate imam subki's defence of imam ibn furak.
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the summary of the discussion so far:
1. imam dhahabi's comments in his siyar and tarikh al-islam are the basis for the slander of imam ibn furak.
2. dhahabi's notice gives the impression that ibn Hazm took it from abu'l walid baji.
3. there is no proof whatsoever that imam abu'l walid baji - a major ash'ari theologian who is a student of ibn furak's student (abu dharr al-harawi) circulated this story.
4. the wahabis who circulate this story acknowledge that the attribution to al-baji could not be found - HOWEVER, they extrapolate that since dhahabi had said it, he might have access to some source which is unknown to us. (THIS OBJECTION will be clarified first)
5. ibn Hazm's statements about ash'aris do not amount to shucks. he is a rabid anti-ash'arite who does not even hesitate to circulate outright lies. and it is unfortunate that dhahabi forwards ibn Hazm's lies without comment, perhaps because of his own antipathy to the ash'aris.
may Allah ta'ala forgive imam dhahabi. but we should not follow him in his error. and we should clear the name of an imam like ibn furak.
6. we have also seen that from ibn furak's time to dhahabi's - 300+ years the apocryphal story does not appear.
wa billahi't tawfiq.
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so let us restart this one.
we still have to see what imam subki says about imam ibn furak, in sha'Allah.
but there are a few key pieces in between we need to know about to appreciate imam subki's defence of imam ibn furak.
---
the summary of the discussion so far:
1. imam dhahabi's comments in his siyar and tarikh al-islam are the basis for the slander of imam ibn furak.
2. dhahabi's notice gives the impression that ibn Hazm took it from abu'l walid baji.
3. there is no proof whatsoever that imam abu'l walid baji - a major ash'ari theologian who is a student of ibn furak's student (abu dharr al-harawi) circulated this story.
4. the wahabis who circulate this story acknowledge that the attribution to al-baji could not be found - HOWEVER, they extrapolate that since dhahabi had said it, he might have access to some source which is unknown to us. (THIS OBJECTION will be clarified first)
5. ibn Hazm's statements about ash'aris do not amount to shucks. he is a rabid anti-ash'arite who does not even hesitate to circulate outright lies. and it is unfortunate that dhahabi forwards ibn Hazm's lies without comment, perhaps because of his own antipathy to the ash'aris.
may Allah ta'ala forgive imam dhahabi. but we should not follow him in his error. and we should clear the name of an imam like ibn furak.
6. we have also seen that from ibn furak's time to dhahabi's - 300+ years the apocryphal story does not appear.
wa billahi't tawfiq.
Last edited:
abu Hasan
Administrator
what do we know of al-Hakim? the author of al-mustadrak?
let us consult dhahabi's siyar:
muhammad ibn abdullah ibn muhammad ibn Hamduwayh ibn nuaym ibn al-Hakam.
the imam, the Hafiz, the critic (naqid), the prominent scholar (`allamah) grandmaster of hadith scholars (shaykh al-muHaddithin) abu Abdullah ibn al-bayyi'y al-Dabiyy al-Tahmani al-nisaburi, al-shafiyi who was also a profilic author.
he was born on monday, the 3rd of rabi'y al-awwal of the year: 321 AH.
he pursued the study of hadith from an early age, due to the influence of his father and his maternal uncle.
his first class of hadith ('hearing' / sama'a) was in 330 AH (i.e. when al-Hakim was merely 9 years old).
he used to write the narrations of abu Hatim ibn Hibban in the year 334 AH, when he was 13 years old.
he obtained elevated chains (al-asanid al-aaliyah) in khurasan, iraq and ma-wara' al-nahr (transoxiana).
he heard (hadith) from nearly two thousand hadith masters (shaykh) more or less.
in nishapur alone, he heard from a thousand souls; and when he travelled to iraq, he was twenty years old and reached there shortly after the passing of ismayil al-saffar.
he narrates from his own father, who met imam muslim, the author of sahih muslim.
....
....
[list of names that al-Hakim narrates from]
those who narrate from al-Hakim are: daraquTni, even though al-daraquTni was his (al-Hakim's) teacher;
....
[list of names who narrate from al-Hakim]
abu dharr al-harawi
...
abu bakr al-bayhaqi,
abu'l qasim al-qushayri
...
he wrote books and referenced others (sannafa wa kharraja); he criticised and apprised narrators (jaraHa wa `addal); he ratified hadith as authentic and identifed flaws (SaHHaHa wa `allal); he was an ocean of knowledge, even though he had an inclination towards some shiyi ideas. [tashayyu`in qaleel]
he passed away in theyear 403 AH.
the imam, the Hafiz, the critic (naqid), the prominent scholar (`allamah) grandmaster of hadith scholars (shaykh al-muHaddithin) abu Abdullah ibn al-bayyi'y al-Dabiyy al-Tahmani al-nisaburi, al-shafiyi who was also a profilic author.
he was born on monday, the 3rd of rabi'y al-awwal of the year: 321 AH.
he pursued the study of hadith from an early age, due to the influence of his father and his maternal uncle.
his first class of hadith ('hearing' / sama'a) was in 330 AH (i.e. when al-Hakim was merely 9 years old).
he used to write the narrations of abu Hatim ibn Hibban in the year 334 AH, when he was 13 years old.
he obtained elevated chains (al-asanid al-aaliyah) in khurasan, iraq and ma-wara' al-nahr (transoxiana).
he heard (hadith) from nearly two thousand hadith masters (shaykh) more or less.
in nishapur alone, he heard from a thousand souls; and when he travelled to iraq, he was twenty years old and reached there shortly after the passing of ismayil al-saffar.
he narrates from his own father, who met imam muslim, the author of sahih muslim.
....
....
[list of names that al-Hakim narrates from]
those who narrate from al-Hakim are: daraquTni, even though al-daraquTni was his (al-Hakim's) teacher;
....
[list of names who narrate from al-Hakim]
abu dharr al-harawi
...
abu bakr al-bayhaqi,
abu'l qasim al-qushayri
...
he wrote books and referenced others (sannafa wa kharraja); he criticised and apprised narrators (jaraHa wa `addal); he ratified hadith as authentic and identifed flaws (SaHHaHa wa `allal); he was an ocean of knowledge, even though he had an inclination towards some shiyi ideas. [tashayyu`in qaleel]
he passed away in theyear 403 AH.
===================
in this notice, dhahabi narrates this:
ahmad ibn salamah informed me, narrating from muHammad ibn isma'yil al-Tarsusi from ibn Tahir that he asked abu isma'yil abdullah ibn Muhammad al-harawi about abu abdullah al-Hakim and he said: "reliable in hadith; but a filthy rafizi" [thiqatun fi'l hadith, rafiDiyyun khabith].
here dhahabi disagrees with the comment and says:
"certainly not. he was not a rafidi. yes he had shia leaning opinions [yatashayy`a]
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the reason al-Hakim is mentioned here is because he was a contemporary of ibn furak and as dhahabi has noted, he has narrated from ibn furak; al-Hakim passed away one or two years before ibn furak was martyred. [dhahabi mentions two opinions about the year of al-Hakim's passing: 403 AH or 405 AH].
Oowais Qassim Ali
Well-Known Member
The Assassination of al-Ustadh Abu Bakr ibn Furak | Sh. Muhammad bin Yahya al Daghestani
:
He suffered trials as a result of refuting the followers of Abū ‘Abdillāh ibn Karrām (d. 255) who believed that Allāh is a physical body. They invented lies about his beliefs, until eventually he was poisoned and died a martyr in the year 406 H. His body was carried to Naysābūr and he was buried in Hīrah. It is said that supplications made at his grave are readily accepted.
:
He suffered trials as a result of refuting the followers of Abū ‘Abdillāh ibn Karrām (d. 255) who believed that Allāh is a physical body. They invented lies about his beliefs, until eventually he was poisoned and died a martyr in the year 406 H. His body was carried to Naysābūr and he was buried in Hīrah. It is said that supplications made at his grave are readily accepted.
hazrat, i have a humble request — kindly complete it. in shā’ Allāh, i will do the urdu translation. i have been compiling the urdu translations of your posts, though at a slow pace.