Respect for a sayyid

S

Shakil

sunniport user
what is the position on respect for a sayyid according to ahle sunnah.

I was in a discussion on this last night,i stated we respect sayyids of ahle sunnah beliefs,and a sayyid from the deviant group or a sayyid who is a open sinner(fasiq) should not deam the same respect just because he is sayyid.

However other people were of the position regardless of beliefs ,actions we should have the adab of respecting a sayyid.(regardless of what they do etc)

Please share your views
 
my 2 cents worth:

kin'aan was the son of nuH 'ala nabiyyina wa 'alayhis salatu wassalam. he was a kafir. so, nasab is not be all and end all.

please correct me if i'm wrong, but if a sayyid is from ahlu'l bid'ah, he deserves no respect at all. what kind of sayyid is he who doesn't even remember the deen of his grandfather.

inna akramakum 'indAllahi atqakum. this verse comes after the one that talks about nations and tribes. the esteemed are the pious, not those who are the children of great people.

there have been sayyids in the past who were ahlu'l bid'ah but due to their insolence, they are given no respect from ahlus sunnah at all.

i hope people will post from the motherbooks on this issue because what i have written is only from logic.
 
posted earlier by saghe_jilani:

Sayyedina Imam Ahmad Raza Khan Al-Qadiri Rahimullah says even if a Sayyid becomes gumrah or ‘loses the right Islamic path’ on condition he does not reach disbelief (kufr) then also it is ‘obligatory to respect him’ (waajibut tazeem). This respect (tazeem) is due to his ‘relationship’ (nisba) with the Beloved Prophet Aaqa Sayyedina Muhammad Mustafa Ahmed-e-Mujtaba sallal lahu ta'ala alaihi wa aalihi wa sallam.

Allah and his Beloved Habib sallal lahu ta'ala alaihi wa aalihi wa sallam. knows the best.

Please remember this Nacheez in your supplication's.

Jazakallahu Khayrun
 
where does alaHazrat say this? it would be interesting to read the whole discussion of his.
 
so, ayatollah khomeini is also a sayyid, as are 90% of the rafidii ayatollahs and marja e taqleeds. by this ruling--since they aren't kafirs--we should respect them. seems logical to me....
 
Salamun 'alaykum

I believe that Allah has addressed this in the Qur'an where he addresses the children of Israel. Allah always mentions the fact that they do wrong to their soul and adresses their soul.

Islam teaches us without a doubt to respect the flesh and blood and he evidences are ample, however, their soul? Do not find it disrespectful to speak to the soul of a sinner clothed in the blessed flesh of the Prophet sal Allahu alayhi wasallam to tell them they are wrong.

Remind them of their grandfather and his blessed guidance , and the many that went astray from children of Isra'el.
 
faqir said:
respect for khomeini. fantastic.
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khomeini --as far as i am aware has not been declared kaafir by any prominent sunni aalam AND he was a sayyid. the deogandi elders you love so much were declared kaafirs by name by ala hazrat and 500 other ulama of india.

caveat emptor: i don't actually admire khomeini as he was a rafidi but i made the last comment based on this discussion about respecitng sayyids ipse facto.
 
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innovators cannot be sayyid?

nonsense! being sayyid or not is to do with one's geneology and genetics. in shariah if your father is a sayyid you are a sayyid.

that is totally separate from a person's doctrine/dogma [aqidah].

the question was if someone is a sayyid by blood but his or her aqidah is heretical do we still show respect to such a person or not? and it seemed from an earlier post that ala hazrat says that as long as their heresy doesn't cross into kufr we should show respect...

is that a fair precis?
 
Bismillah...

Assalamualaikum wa Rahmatullah...

I once heard Shaykh Yahya Rhodus mention in a private class on the Ahl al-Bayt mention that we love the Ahl al-Bayt once for their connection to Rasulullah SallallahuAlayhiWaSallam and then again for their righteousness. (Shaykh Yahya has studied for years with the Habaib)

I also heard Shaykh Samir an-Nass mention that the Shi'a genealogy is flawed and that the majority of the so called Sayyid's of Iran are questionable in the least.

Finally I would like to question the benefit of bringing up the subject of the "deobandi elders" in posts that have nothing to do with the mentioned topic...
 
a sayyid can never be rafidi. the 'sayyids' in iran came after ismail safavi declared himself divine. btw, there are sunni shafi'i sayyids in iran especially among the kurds
 
Finally I would like to question the benefit of bringing up the subject of the "deobandi elders" in posts that have nothing to do with the mentioned topic...
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the reason i did so was because mr. faqir--who seems to have a soft-spot for deobandits--made a sarcy remark like 'respect for khomeini.fantastic'. my counter was to show that if it is so wrong to respect khomeini --and the reason was for his alleged sayyidness--who was a heretic rafidi but not (as far as i know) declared a kafir by ahlus sunnah scholars, then it is 10x worse to show the sickening respect which faqir always does at every opportunity to the deobandi 'elders' -- who WERE declared kafirs by Sayyidi Ala Hadrat and many other Sunni ulama.

My actual belief is that both the deobandis and the rafidis are equally guilty of heresy and sunnis should shun them both. but, if someone claims to be a sayyid, we should at least respect his bloodline.
 
Bismillah...

Assalamualaikum wa Rahmatullah...

Masha Allah, that's your opinion and that's fine but I would prefer to take a different approach, namelt that of the Habaib that I hav studied with, Sayyidi al-Habib Ali and Sayyidi al-Habib Umar... There opinions on the Deobandi-Bareilawi split are well-known. Unfortunately for some, I do not buy into the "oh the arab scholars were tricked by the hypocrisy of the Deobandi's" argument, particularly since I condier the Mashayekh that I have taken the Spiritual Path with, as people of intellect and foresight.

As for the Deobandi's being Kuffar, waLlahu A'lam, but I respectfully disagree, following the exaple of my teachers...
 
almost all books of fiqh and kalam say that insulting the prophet SallAllahu alayhi wa sallam is kufr.

and if anybody hesitates in such insulting statements being kufr is also a kafir.

qaDi iyaD says that if anybody doubts in the kufr of such a person, he is a kafir alongside him.

I do not buy into the "oh the arab scholars were tricked by the hypocrisy of the Deobandi's" argument
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given the above principles, it would then necessitate ruling many mashayikh - al-iyadhu billah - with takfir. so we say, that the arab scholars probably have an excuse.

and if they disown that excuse and insist that those insulting the prophet SallAllahu alayhi wa sallam, are still sunni muslims, we cannot do anything about that. then, we have to distance ourselves from such people, even if it is anybody.

anybody.

---
if you are talking about present day deobandis - their hypocrisy does not need to be pointed out. they are very personification of that word.

---
there is nothing such as a "bareilwi-deobandi" split. it is a sunni-wahabi argument. the western deobandi may project himself as a sunni, but back home in india/pakistan they wahabis with the only difference of following the hanafi madh'hab. and in fact, the disease of wahabism was imported by those considered as deobandi elders.

Allah ta'ala knows best.
 
NaqshJ is spot on, there is no fatwa as far as I know on Khomeni being a kafir but on those deobandis it is clear they are kafir yet faqir decides to show respect for the kuffaar and murtads al-iyadhu billah. This was the consistency I was talking about. How is it possible for a Muslim to respect or even stay silent when it comes to gustaakh-e-rasool (SAWAW).
 
This is the modern disease of "saaray theek hain" at work (everybody is fine!)
and 'sab musulmaan hain' [we're all muslims]. how come the imams of this faith weren't able to show such generosity to heretics and insulters of the Prophet? صلى الله عليه وسلم

and yet...
when it comes to their elders these same people will bend over backward and sideways and perform more contortions than a Russian ballerina or contortionist to explain away to defend them. Whereas when it comes to the Beloved of Allah صلى الله عليه وسلم being insulted they shrug and say 'unity/we're all muslims/benefit of the doubt brother' etc.

i am the worst muslim ever to set foot on this earth -- a disgrace to the very word muslim--but even i can smell a gustaakh from a mile away and i can say with pride i have, to this day, never knowingly prayed behind a deobandi/shia/ or any other heretic.
 
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