Irfan Shah Mash'hadi in the Tafzili/Rafizi camp

Discussion in 'Aqidah/Kalam' started by Sunni Jaag, Mar 6, 2021.

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  1. Brother Barry

    Brother Barry Veteran

    I was reliably informed that A few of the scholars from this event had a meeting with Mawlana Qamar uz Zaman Azmi who was apparently trying to get Mashhadi to do Tawbah so he advised removal of all videos. I personally think this was a dumb move by QZA and could end up like the Musharaf written repentance circus we witnessed a while back.
     
  2. Aqdas

    Aqdas Staff Member

    A few points why this was the wrong move:

    1. Did they also get those videos taken down by Irfan Shah that contain the heterodoxy? Why only the videos that refute him?

    2. So we shouldn't refute him yet? What if someone heard his heresy, we didn't refute him and this person then died believing that heresy? This is why refutations should occur instantly. Who will be responsible for this person dying on bidah?

    3. Why did they wait this long to take action? Was it so hard to get his number on the day he did the heresies and say: do tawbah or we will release statements.

    4. His actions were public. Why do the repercussions have to be private?

    5. This isn't 19th century India. Fitnah spreads much quicker. Most of those events were broadcast live. So the fitnah spread to the world instantly. Why do we have to wait for the backlash?

    6. Refuting online does help. They feel the pressure. This is how to deal with such people who do these things in the name of Ahl al-Sunnah.

    7. Why does the videos being public or private effect whether he does tawbah or not? Tawbah is for his benefit. Are egos that inflated that tawbah will not be done if the ego is damaged by public refutations? I really don't understand this 'oh, we're trying for tawbah so please delete videos.' What's the connection? Let the videos stay public and he must do tawbah too. Stop massaging egos. If he doesn't like public shaming, then stop spreading rifd.

    8. It is most likely because of the public backlash that ulama have finally taken action. Otherwise, maybe they would brush it under carpet.
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2021
  3. Aqdas

    Aqdas Staff Member

    Exactly.

    'You want us to take it down? We will when he repents.'
     
  4. Brother Barry

    Brother Barry Veteran

    It shouldn't have been taken down before repentance. These 'senior Ulama' shouldn't be acting like senior clowns.
     
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  5. Surati

    Surati Well-Known Member

    Maybe they actually will since it has now become a matter of utmost importance for these “Senior Ulamas” to take “responsibility to get Irfan Shah to repent”. I wonder where was their sense of responsibility before the video was released.

    Before this, did these specific Senior Ulamas tackle the Irfan Shah issue? It has been going on for over a year now and he’s been in the UK for quite a bit.
     
  6. Surati

    Surati Well-Known Member

    I’m asking for the reason behind the decision to request for the removal of the video.
    And which senior Ulama?
     
  7. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    Have they given a deadline or a plan of action or something, or is it just one of those 'until further notice' things?
     
    Unbeknown likes this.
  8. Sunni Jaag

    Sunni Jaag Active Member

    At the request of Senior Ulema who have taken responsibility to get Irfan Shah to repent.
     
  9. Surati

    Surati Well-Known Member

    Why has it been taken down?
     
    Unbeknown likes this.
  10. shahnawazgm

    shahnawazgm Veteran

    Also even if he does Tawbah (I doubt he will) he should no longer be allowed to sit on any mimbar to deliver speeches to the public. He has lost credibility and is not worthy of delivering speeches to the public. He should first sit at the feet of the ulema and learn (his ego will prevent him from doing so). An ignorant delivering lectures is dangerous to the religion.
     
  11. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    I would go a step ahead and say that if this is the pattern of "tawbah" that he employs, it's worse than not doing any tawbah and it's pretty much an open declaration tantamount to "deen is my plaything, and I'm serious about nothing"

    If Sunni ulema are not astute and fall for these shenanigans, they too deserve to be boycotted. It's about time the awam took things in their own hands if the scholars are sound asleep.
     
    Surati likes this.
  12. Aqdas

    Aqdas Staff Member

    Irfan Shah sahib has over 20 heterodox actions and statements.

    It is necessary to repent from them all.
    A combined tawbah that doesn't specify each one isn't enough.

    Otherwise, a person could make a dozen statements of kufr and/or bidah. When reproached, he simply says: 'I make tawbah for any kufr or bidah I've committed.'

    Hang on. Next week, he could say: 'I did tawbah from kufr/bidah. Such and such isn't kufr/bidah.'

    So we're back at square one!

    Who's with me?

    Therefore:

    1. ALL the heresies need to be brought up.
    2. He acknowledges them.

    and THEN

    3. Makes tawbah from them ALL.
     
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  13. Aqdas

    Aqdas Staff Member

    Shah sahib has to repent from all points. Not just the ibn Umar رضي الله عنهما one.
     
    Ghulam Ali likes this.
  14. Sunni Jaag

    Sunni Jaag Active Member

    Video taken down at the request of Senior Ulema who are in direct contact with Irfan Shah Sahib regarding repentance on the 20 objections.
     
  15. Sunni Jaag

    Sunni Jaag Active Member



    20 objections against Irfan Shah Sahib.
     
    hasan likes this.
  16. Ahmet Tayfur

    Ahmet Tayfur New Member

    Salaam

    does anyone have another link to the video by Allaama Sabir Sb recently with the other Ulamaa. I was watching it on Youtube but now the video unavailable and is private
     
  17. Aqdas

    Aqdas Staff Member

    Mufti Aslam message to Irfan Shah.

     
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  18. Sunni Jaag

    Sunni Jaag Active Member

  19. Waqar786

    Waqar786 Veteran

    This is really disappointing to hear because Shah Sahib's antics in Pakistan caused so much unnecessary fitna within the ranks of Sunnis. I was expecting him to be given a cold shoulder, especially after their comments against Hazrat Abdullah ibn Umar. On the other hand Shah Sahib is not really a big figure amongst Sunnis in the UK anymore and has not been in the last couple of years.
     
  20. Aqdas

    Aqdas Staff Member

    Some ulama in Bradford and elsewhere have reaccepted Irfan Shah sahib into their circle or rather have continued joining his.

    Why?

    I want to see the public repentance and retraction from all the major contraventions he committed on his last visit to Pakistan.

    These ulama who have sat with him post-Pakistan need to explain why they sit with someone who went against Sunni methodology.

    And don't anyone say I have it in for him. Don't.
     

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