Is drinking "bhang" halal?

Discussion in 'Hanafi Fiqh' started by Rizzykhan, Oct 3, 2016.

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  1. Rizzykhan

    Rizzykhan New Member

    This is a very good question and I am wondering if any scholars have addressed this issue in recent times?
    There seems to be so much evidence for the use of cannabis oil and so many people who have written/blogged/video'ed their experiences with this.

    Some of the questions from a layman's perspective;
    Can it be used for alternative medication?
    What is the difference between the use of morphine when given by a Dr and Cannabis oil? effects are similar to a certain extent one is 'legal' the other is 'illegal'.

    I know of a case first hand where a Cancer patient had literally given up hope and no medication was working and Dr's were unable to operate due to the state of the person's health. At this point, the family members obtained Cannabis oil and over the course of 6weeks-8weeks gave him x amount of drops per day.
    The patient was better in health/eating again/put on weight, then when he went to the hospital and the Dr's had reported the cancer cells have been reduced by a massive margin and then the operation was done immediately and they did ask what treatment he was given.
    I know about this situation first hand and we took advice from local ulamaah and they allowed the use under the principle of preservation of life when there was no other options.

    Is anyone aware of any modern day fatwas and research from a scholarly level about this? I think as time goes by this is going to be a very common asked question.
    I understand it probably opens the floodgates for people miss-using and there is always that risk but a very relevant topic of today's age I believe.
  2. Aqdas

    Aqdas Staff Member

    So can one use cannabis oil as medicine?
  3. YoungBrother

    YoungBrother New Member

    Why would someone want to even have a sip of alcohol anyway, the smell of it makes me sick! And I thought Khamr is alcohol from dates aswel as grapes, or am I wrong?
  4. yes brother imran!
    that is the panjabi version of the farsi saying, "neem hakim khatrah e jaan, neem mullah khatrah e imaan!"

    sadly the Net is full of these neem-mullahs!
  5. there is an expression, 'neem hakim jaan na huttara, neem ullah iman na huttara' :):)
  6. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    alaHazrat - sort of - paid tribute to hafiz's ghazal and it is the first poem in the second volume of his diwan, hadayiq e bakhshish;

    a laa yaa ayyuha's saaqi adir ka'asan wa naawilhaa
    key bar yaad e shah e kawsar binaa saazeem maHfilhaa
  7. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    a laa yaa ayyuha's saaqi adir ka'asan wa naawilhaa
    ke `ishq aasaaN namood awwal, walay uftaadah mushkil-haa

    listen! heed, o cup-bearer! give us the goblet and let us partake -
    for, love seems to be easy at first, but then we suffer its asperity*

    the translation of the couplet makes it somewhat arid. another variant translation would be:
    listen! heed, o cup-bearer! give us the goblet and let us partake -
    for, love seemed easy at first but, my bare feet stumble and falter at the difficulties.
    so, does the drink steadies him from stumbling?
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2008
  8. Ya abaa Nuwaas: I think my cup runneth over....

    !قد طفح كيلي... وغمرني السهاف
  9. ..keh eshgh avvol asan namood vali bad az mushkilhaa!
    hafez shirazi chishti

    another thought: are bhang and bhangra related?

    Last edited: Apr 28, 2008
  10. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    stating positions - or cherry picking as they say - and choosing to ignore the unpalatable is not truly following a madh'hab.

    i think it is a long time since we argued on this matter and if it be the case then, let us:
    a laa yaa ayyuha's saaqi adir ka'asan wa naawilhaa

    Last edited: Apr 28, 2008
  11. Please read: Imam al-TaHawi's sharH ma'aani al-athar:kitab al-ashribah; Imam al-Aini: umdah al Qari sharH SaHiiH al-bukhari,: kitaab al-ashribah and also his commentary on Abu Bakr al Marghini's al-hidaayah; But start with the MabsooT.

    For the survey of the extent of the ikhtilaaf, Ibn Rushd's bidaayah al-mujtahid
    is stupendous (book of beverages - there's an english trans).

    I know that the positions of a given mujtahid muTlaq / mustaQill ain't ascertained precisely from works of khilaf -as you mentiond last time but Ibn Rushd summarises the same as borne out in Imam Tahawi and Imam al-aini's explanations, which of course are the views of Abu Haniifah - which no Hanafi has denied.

    I haven't read Ibn Abi Layla's or Ibn Shabrumah's, Sufyan's positions outside of the Bidaayah though..

    and Allah ta'ala nu behtr pata.

  12. is this really a difference of opinion matter? if so, then it is not absolutely haram? yay or nay?
  13. the warmth of your welcome is a nice simoom/zephyr, mawaaliyya al-kuramaa' (and I'm not being sarky).

    I feel a bit like the prodigal son, in the Gospel. A toast to your civility. (I'll clink myself unless you're drinking Kaliber.)

    (ps 'ye olde shoppe' some people think the pronunciation of 'ye' starts with a 'y' but really the 'y' is representing the 'yogh' this extinct letter today is 'th' so the pron. of 'ye' is the ordinary 'the').

    Yes Jack Daniels or Samuel Adams or whatever but you mustn't get drunk. Imaam MuHammad said that if you intend nasha then taking even the first step towards the Inn is Haraam.

    Imam Ahmad acknowledges the hadiith of ibn Abbaas to be saHeeH (as does s arnaUUT in his edition of Imaam alTaHaawi's sharH ma'aani al-aathaar as meeting the standards of Imaam Muslim and Bukhaari.

    "wine is haraam small or large amounts..and the intoxicating amount from all other beverages".

    But Imaam Ahmad can only say 'huwa ghayr raajiH' 'it's not effective' he wrote a tract on drinks. Imam bukhari in his chapter headings also attempts to refute Imam Abu Haniifah on this point of fiqh i.e khamr is not restricted to grapes.

    It wasn't just the hanafites: Ibn Abi Layla, Sufyan al-thawri held similar opinions. I don't know why the latter day Hanafis have no longer kept the positions of the earlier ones, if that. Imam al-Ainii certainly endorses a khamr is only wine policy in his refutations of Imam ibn Hajar al-asqalaanis stance. Perhaps it's because of the spread of fisq ('corruption' - not the journalist). Allahu a'lam. I mean look at the English unable to hold their drink yet the continentals pull it off demurely.

    That not a lot of people know this, isn't surprising after all..

    For example that IsHaaq was the dhabiiH being an islamic opinion is unheard of.

    All the more outlandish then QurTubi's statement: 'the majority of Ulamaa' say it's isHaaq. (page 99, first line of second paragraph under surah al Saaffaat)

    This despite 'absolute' 'obvious' proofs that it was 'ismaa'iil. And that it's 'obvious' that Qur'an prohibits all intoxicating beverages.

    Sorry can't have 'chianti' that's italian wine i.e. khamr. which is haraam Qat'iyyan (unless there's necessity)

    (is human flesh edible - I sometimes bite my nails/lips/dead skin). Funny because I just et some lovely mum-made 'karaawareh' or kawaari' in proper arabic .i.e lamb trotters. the Hasaa'/ shora was nice and gelatinous. But I do digress...

    anecdote: I once was invited to a pakistani's house with a friend, in Qatar. As hospitality is the wont of eastern folk, they asked if I wanted something to drink..before I could answer he said, we've got some nice Pak beer (I know cobra - hindi but I think this one was 'hushiyaar samp aur bhooleh kabootr' brand beer.

    we drank, and it was quite nice. then afterwards my friend says it's not haram since the word in the qur'an is 'avoid' it ! I then retorted but that's also the word used when prohibiting idol worship. If only he'd read umda alqaari he'd have come from the right tack.
  14. SaeeN Afzal (ye olde comrade of ASFA days)
    so, are you saying it is okay for us to have a jack daniels with coke as long as we don't get so plastered we cannot tell the difference between the land and the empyrean? if this is really the position of so many Hanafites then why don't more people know about it? One of the first things we learn when kids is 'sharaab is haraam'. It is so widespread a knowledge that it would be considered amongst the zaruriyaat [since in one of his tracts sayyidina ala hadrat defines the zaruriyat as being those things known by the common people]

    Maybe we could discuss this over a Chianti with fava beans.....;-)
  15. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    nothing c&d about it; we did not want to press you if you chose to be anonymous.

    that, we recognized from your very first line on this forum. perhaps, this should solve your perplexity here.

    we knowd it precious. we did.

    you seem to have simply chosen to read - and infer - that which suits you. while the above argument is not disputed, the explanation however, does not allow nabidh in our times. read radd al-muHtar if you like.

    al-qawl al-faSiH fi ta'ayyun adh-dhabiH. while it is true that there is a difference of opinion, the first opinion that it was sayyiduna ismayil alayhi's salatu wa's salam is the dhabiH was related by:

    ali [ibn abi talib]
    ibn `umar
    abu hurayrah
    abu't Tufayl
    sayid ibn jubayr
    yusuf ibn mihran
    Hasan al-baSri
    muHammad ibn ka'ab al-quraZi
    sa'yid ibn al-musayyib
    abu ja'afar [imam] al-baqar
    abu SaliH
    rabi'y ibn anas
    abu `amr ibn al-`ala
    aHmed ibn Hanbal
    and one of the two reports from ibn `abbas [the other being sayyiduna is'Haq alayhi's salatu wa's salam]

    and is the preferred position of most muHaddithin.

    also, bayDawi insisted upon it and said: 'it is obvious.'

    ibn kathir in his tafsir said: [about the hadith of ram horns in the ka'abah]: this is absolute proof that ismayil was the sacrifice/dhabiH.

    in the same paper, suyuTi ends it with: 'i used to lean towards this position as a quranic exegete [that sayyiduna is'Haq alayhis salatu was salam was the dhabiH] but currently, i am undecided [mutawaqqif] on the matter.

    i was only hinting that the possiblity of the existentialist being afzal. [hint,hint:being..]
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2008
  16. PS do you know that anecdote that went on
    between Imam Abu Haniifah and a Shi'i (I forgot where I read it - anacardium/cashew nuts for memory power? but I happen to be allergic to nuts - the edible kind I mean but I digress):

    The shi'i: why don't you let your son work in a pub (ar. Haanah) ?
    Abu Haniifah: Only if you let you daughter contract mut'ah marriage!
  17. Yes, khamr's only wine - which is totally prohibited but with other intoxicants just don't get drunk. The definition of being drunk is when you can't tell the ground from the sky; a man from woman etc.

    that was the view of Ibrahiim al-nakhii, suufyaan al thawrii, Abu Haniifa, the Kufans, the majority of the Basrans, Ibn Abi LaylaTaHaawi, al-shurayk, ibn Shabrumah.

    I have read the sharH of the Hidaayah of marghiniini by al-Aini where he again defends the hanafii view that not all intoxicants are khamr therefore not Haraam per se - unlike wine.

    He referred to his sharH in his umdat al Qari, kitaab al -ashribah, commentary on bukhari, where he presents the same view. (same heading in TaHaawii's ma'aani al-aathaar.)

    I don't know anything about subcontinental scholars (except shah waliAllah al-daHlawii) save patchy knowledge of names.

    I shan't ask about the dhabiiH. please - haven't we moved on?

    In fact I'll tell you.

    with all due deference, of course, if you generously lend me your ears: your lobes and pinnas, canals, drums and anvils...(shouldn't that be lending eyes?)


    QurTubii in his exegesis states that "the Ulamaa' have differed concerning the identity of the dhabiiH: some say Isma'il but the majority say 'IsHaaq'"

    QurTubii himself as well as the savant sh Al-jilaani in his ghunyah (unless u suspect idraaj) say the dhabiiH was isHaaq.

    another view is, it was 'isma'iil'

    The third view is "God knows better who it was: could've been either"

    It's simply ingenuous and implausible to say the Ulamaa were 'influenced by the People of the Scripture' or that The Companions who subscribed to the son's being IsHaaq were 'perhaps repeating the scriptuaries' as ibn kathiir surmises. suyUti wrote a tract on it.

    Strangely enough nowadays everyone says it was Isma'il, if you say IsHaaq you're suspected of zionist sympathies.


    I'm not sure if people do know me...sorry if I've appeared arcane or cloak&daggerish but really I'm an open book, there's no mystery about me.

    my name is afzal (urdu) or afDal in proper arabic. tasharraftu - min jadiid ;-)
  18. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    how could it be any other than him?

    next he will ask about the dhabiH: is it sayyiduna ismayil or sayyiduna is'Haq? alayhima's salatu wa's salam.

    don't we know you sir?
  19. abu nibras

    abu nibras Staff Member

  20. abu nibras

    abu nibras Staff Member

    asfa dejavu......

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