what is the name of the book in the dars-e-nizaami syllabi that teaches this model in the above form?
The ptolemaic (and aristotelian) model is as shown: so moon - first heaven mercury - second venus 3rd sun 4th mars 5th jupiter 6th saturn 7th fixed stars 8th in the current i.e.copernican model there is no such concept as a universe made up of concentric spheres so the idea of 'in which heaven is the moon?' is meaningless.
how does the model affect this? so where is the moon in the other models? what is then in the second sky if the moon is in the first sky (in this same model)?
Well, Hazrat Sahib is obviously referring to the classical Ptolemaic model of the Universe ie the geocentric one aka the medieval model believed in by Muslim and Christian theologians alike ever since it was first proposed by Ptolemy. One cannot blame him either as this model is still the one taught in the Dars e Nizami and all traditional madrassahs. In this model the moon is in the first heaven and so forth. I am not sure if, in this model, man-made satellites fit anywhere! It is not a criticism of Hazrat Sahib (he is my pir and a saint of Allah) as his tone was sceptical rather than outright denial. However it does make one wonder that if our ulama aur mashaikh are still being taught the Ptolemaic model of cosmology in the 21st century then no wonder we are in this state. (Having said that Ameer e Ahle Sunnat is a wali and murshid e kaamil and errors in astronomy are not in any way relevant.) However, shouldn't we reinterpret religious scripture in light of proven scientific facts such as the Copernican model of the Solar System and evolution, 92 natural chemical elements (as opposed to the four classic "elements" of earth, water, fire and air -- yes, I've had discussions with a respected Sunni maulvi who insisted that everything was composed of these 4 elements!) etc. so as not to appear foolish and thus harm Islam? Since I dont want in any way for aspersions to be cast on a man of Allah like Ameer e Ahle Sunnat for anything I've said I am going to make this into another thread and ask the mods to close this one.
so by inference are the satellites, orbitting the earth(which are also in the first sky), non-existent too - based on the first sky theory for the moon landing negation?
i was listening to a speech by Hazrat Ameer e Ahle Sunnat, may Allah preserve him, and he mentioned the moon landings in a very skeptical way saying that people say they went to the moon but I cannot understand how they could have as the moon is in the first heaven; perhaps they went up somewhere and took some pictures and came back down?
The biggest question that really puzzled many is that why was the American flag fluttering? As moon had no atmosphere. Many theories have been put forward. The people who claim all this a hoax say that they landed in some AREA-51 that resembled like moon, but was not bereft of air. A possible theory!!
answers to some hoax theories: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/the-apollo-hoax-theories-1730408.html
of course you cannot prove you do not live in a matrix either sidi! (that's because its impossible to prove a negative).
My friend asked me whether we do really live in the MATRIX. I told him, ofcourse we dont, we are Muslims, we know the reality, there is Allah; but then I told him, unfortunately, we do live in the MATRIX; he said, what is the MATRIX? I said, the MATRIX is out there; its all around you; you can see it when you go out of the house; when you look out of the window; when you go to the mosque; when you go to work; to eat; its the world of illusions that has been created to blind you from the truth; he said, what truth? I said, that you are a SLAVE my friend; that you have been born into bondage of a very subtle kind!
apparently a recon mission has found evidence: http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2009/07/17/apollo-landing-sites-imaged-by-lro/ is this image that clear or is it the emperor's clothes all over again? apart from the crystal clear arrows and labels, i cannot make out anything. in the second picture, all the shadows point in one direction, whereas the LM shadow is in the other. yeah, i am a dunce.
hahaha I like the way you think brother Abu Hasan. Sadly, in the current world order, anyone who questions the status quo or the story popularly believed by masses of sheeple is called anything from a lunatic to a traitor to a terrorist, and in the case of our beloved Sunni sheeple, a wahabi or a deobandi if someone dares point to some "Sufi" pir sahab's or "sheikhul Islam's" brand new khirqa! My personal favorite was a satirical caption I saw on a cartoon depicting the landing, that said something like: Americans successfully land in an Arizona desert.
i have been a moon-landing skeptic for a long time. not that i think that it is impossible, but there are many unanswered questions. sure, the guy out there on badastronomy ridicules and shouts out the skeptics but still, i am not one to accept something just because 'experts' do. experts can be wrong. this thing reinforces the suspicion: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090716/ap_on_sc/us_sci_moon_video --- sounds like saddam and his wmd's all over again. nasa apparently had shortage of tapes, so they 'reused' many tapes including the not-so-important 'moon landing' tapes. just like nobody has been there for 40 years after the so-called 'moon landing'. nasa might have computers and technology far more advanced and powerful than what was available 40 years ago, but why was another attempt never made? ---
