Moon sighting issues. lets learn.

Discussion in 'General Topics' started by Hanafi Sunni, Apr 4, 2022.

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  1. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    are letters of Ala Hazrat's and other fuqaha's times equatable to official news releases of our times, or other electronically verified official communications?

    if possible, cite a sharh of the hadith/riwayah you have in mind, regarding why the Eid days were different in Makkah and Madinah.

    sorry, i'm just trying to understand the issue better.
  2. Umar99

    Umar99 Veteran

    That is not always the case, for years people have been sighting and have sighted on the 29th. Even if the month is 30 days then this is fine, as rasulAllah ﷺ said if it is cloudy then this should be done.
  3. Shadman

    Shadman Active Member

    Also curious about this scenario if remote testimonies are not accepted:

    Hamza (who lives in the UK) Skype calls Zayd who lives in Morocco and ask Zayd if the new moon of Shawwal have been spotted.

    Zayd: I have not seen it but my cousin Amr (who lives arbitrarily x km from Zayd) did.

    Hamza: Can you get a face to face testimony from him?

    Zayd: Sure(drives to Amr's house)

    *After initial greetings with Amr. Zayd calls back Hamza on Skype and introduces his cousin Amr and proceeds with the face to face testimony*

    In the above scenario, the shahada of Amr is accepted from Zayd's point of view. So why is it still not accepted from Hamza's point of view?
  4. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    Salam Alaikum and belated Eid Mubarak to all.

    Let me add to that -

    What abt taghayyure zaman?

    What about a foreign Qadi's or foreign government's statement published on their official website of the minister of religious affairs as well as government and blasted all over the news channels.

    Example given was Morocco.

    So if Moroccan government issued an official statement through their verified twitter account, and on the ministry's website, blasted all over their tv channels, and the official letter is circulated worldwide on the religion ministry's letterhead, with the Qadi's or religious affairs minister's seal, signature, and a verifiable QR code - is that acceptable?

    (Or will we follow internationally accepted protocol? - it's not really official communication from one government to another unless it is communicated from one country's foreign ministry to another country's - but then that is for individual cases of individual matters between the two countries, not for something so mass transmitted. See below re are all shahaadaat the same.)

    Can a verifiable and traceable QR code be equated to a person's or a government department's or business entity's official seal? (Just curious. I like them QR codes)

    He also said Muslim fiqh as well as uk courts don't accept remote testimonies by zoom/video/skype etc.

    Good point... But

    Are all testimonies (shahaadaat) the same?

    Is the issue of a one off crime in some back alley of bradford or rabat the same thing as a government announcing something in an official capacity, and it becoming known immediately to every man, woman, and child globally - to the extent it becomes mutawatir instantly?

    PS. I only saw like 10 or 15 minutes from in between. My questions related to that section.
    Last edited: May 4, 2022
  5. Shadman

    Shadman Active Member

    Is shahada via video chat acceptable?
  6. Aqdas

    Aqdas Staff Member

    These are a few objections I've heard to the local sighting advocated by Mufti Zahid Rizwi

    1. Because there is cloud in the UK, we will often or always have 30 day months.
    2. If 1, then won't we fall 3-4 days behind other people who follow global sighting, etc?
    Last edited: May 4, 2022
  7. Hanafi Sunni

    Hanafi Sunni Active Member

    So who is/will be responsible for the 1 fast that the Monday group missed?

    If mufti zahid "is right"
  8. Surati

    Surati Well-Known Member

    Mufti Zahid Rizwi is right to celebrate Eid today.
  9. Hanafi Sunni

    Hanafi Sunni Active Member

  10. Hanafi Sunni

    Hanafi Sunni Active Member

    Last edited: May 1, 2022
  11. Shadman

    Shadman Active Member

    Last edited: Apr 4, 2022
  12. Hanafi Sunni

    Hanafi Sunni Active Member

    A very good explanation by Allama azmi sahab.

    He speaks about various issues around accepting moon reports from many countries around the world.

    question is: why does the uk contact morocco and africa to get info on whether moon has been sighted or not?

    Isn't this against what Alahazrat wrote in FR. where he says that shahdah should be taken in person, and that letters are not supposed to be used to deliver shahdah?

    can somebody please explain this to me?
    Azmi sahab mentioned below that its not logical to contact chile or south america and seek moon reports from there as when its day in the uk then its night in their countries etc. but doesnt that apply to africa or morocco where sunset times differ by a good few hours , despite the fact that the clock might be only an hour behind or forward compared to uk?

    even in the time of our Prophet Sallalahu Alayhi Wasallam Mecca and Madina would have different days i.e eids different. so why are we trying to contact people from different countries to get a report.

    ok contacting is fine, but is the shahadah bil musafaha (face to face) as required by the hanafi fiqh?
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2022
  13. Hanafi Sunni

    Hanafi Sunni Active Member

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