ok thanks. jazak Allah khayr unbeknown. will listen to the speech and come back to the thread in a day or two or three or four. (i'm gonna get fired from both work and home if i continue spending the same kind of time on the forum as i've been doing lately.) i appreciate and understand some of the points you mentioned. i do understand that the situation is messy and ugly due to the many levels of politics involved (B v M; desi politics with hindus, maybe local gangs are involved too i dunno, etc etc) threats of violence to them or against their families? yeah i'm appalled by that situation too. another major headache. --- i think we can all sing a song about the troubled times Sunnis are in - a sad song! i will get back to this thread with a fresh mind.