Sayyiduna Ameer Muawiyah رضي الله ﺗﻌﺎﻟﯽٰ عنه

Discussion in 'General Topics' started by AMQadiri, May 2, 2018.

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  1. Aqib alQadri

    Aqib alQadri Veteran

    I heard the speech: muzammil is praising Syeduna Ali (radi Allaho anho) higher than the Holy Prophet (salla Allaho alayhe wa sallam).

    He says (translated) "Allah has not created anyone better than Ali"

    Last edited: Jan 19, 2016
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  2. Harris786

    Harris786 Veteran

    muzammil the rafizi idiot with his illogical nonsense tried to pull a sly one trying to get the old fool off the hook at 2.30-2.45 in his Gujrati lingo. Mufakkir returned the favour after the fat rafizis outburst in Bolton on Sunday.

    The likes of Nisar Baig, Fazl Ahmed and Zahid Shah need to denounce and refute muzammil and their old mate from Wathamstow and make their position clear, especially when Zahid’s son is regurgitating the same rafizi nonsense.

    Javid should provide them a platform at Ghamkol to clear themselves or apologise to the Sunnis of Birmingham for hosting them and passing himself and these clowns as leaders of the Sunnis.
  3. Aqib alQadri

    Aqib alQadri Veteran

    the same is true also for Minhaajis: they follow the same lines because Dr Padri says the Minhaaji mosques are open for Christian polytheists, and Muslims who praise Syeduna Ameer Muawiyyah should be kicked out from them.
  4. shahnawazgm

    shahnawazgm Veteran

    "Rafizi" and "intelligence" are two mutually exclusive terms!
  5. Aqib alQadri

    Aqib alQadri Veteran

    Wow! What a response from Nawazuddin!!! but not so intelligent.

    Does not almost every SUNNI kid know the Ayat ulKursi by heart? And do we not know that "Ali" is also one of the names of Allah??????

    You have acted EXACTLY like the RAFIDHIS who claim that Syeduna Ali is actually Allah (just as the Christians say about Syeduna Eisa). And in many debates with the RAFIDHIS, when they are defeated, they recite this very Ayah, and jump off the stage, as if they have won the debate!

    you disclosed yourself Nawazuddin and fell for a SIMPLE bait - you ain't so smart.

    brother Bazdawi: we don't take our deen from doubtful sources, even if he is explaining from the Holy Qur'an.
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2016
  6. Nawazuddin

    Nawazuddin Veteran

    Brother I think they are all easy to find but if there is anything in particular you require then let me know.
  7. Nawazuddin

    Nawazuddin Veteran

  8. shahnawazgm

    shahnawazgm Veteran

    According to rafizis ALL who love Hazrat Ameer Muawiya (RA) are nasibis. The nasibi line is Hasnains most used term for sunnis on his home rafizi forum.
  9. Aqib alQadri

    Aqib alQadri Veteran

    the word "Ali" has been inserted by the bud-mazhab, not without intent.
  10. Abu Hamza

    Abu Hamza Hanafi-Maturidi

    Alhumdulillah, sayyīd irfanī miyah ashrafi publicly humiliated molvi muzzamīl for his insolent behaviour, shame on the rest of the molvī's who sat there listeneing to his rubbish.

    @Nawazuddin - it seems you & your rafidi pals deliberately ignore/reject sāhih āhadith in order to insult the noble companions. Is sayyidunā muawwiyāh [radi'Allāhu anh] inclusive of the following hadith?

    لا تسبوا اصحابي فان احدكم لو انفق مثل احد ذهبا ما ادرك مد احدهم و لا نصيفه
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  11. Bazdawi

    Bazdawi Active Member

    The least you could do is reference properly so another person can check the references from the book himself.

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  12. Paradise Seeker

    Paradise Seeker Active Member

    according to you Hasnain most sunni are nasibis??
  13. Nawazuddin

    Nawazuddin Veteran

    Yes. Indeed.
  14. shahnawazgm

    shahnawazgm Veteran

    Let me see, I have two options:
    1) Two and a half hour bakwas by a shia negating tafzil
    2) A one sentence fatwa by the great mujaddid, Imam-e-Ahle Sunnat, Ahmad Raza Khan (RA) on the ijma of tafzil

    Are you trying to say that option #2 should be ignored and instead we ought to be enlightened by the would be mufakkir?

    Will this be all 12 ?

    Not that I trust wikipedia but ironically....
  15. Nawazuddin

    Nawazuddin Veteran

    It is not your fault, your nasibiyyat has clouded your judgement. Ahl al-Sunnah have a middle path between the shiah and the nasibis. Here is what ahl al-sunnat Imams have stated:

    There is Ijma of ahl al-sunnah that Hazrat Muawiya was a baghi/rebel:

    1. Imam al-San`ani in his famous commentry subul al-salaam on Imam Ibn Hajr al-asqalani's book bulugh al-maram says:

    والحديث دليل على أن الفئة الباغية معاوية ومن في حزبه والفئة المحقة علي رضي الله عنه ومن في صحبته وقد نقل الإجماع من أهل السنة بهذا القول جماعة من أئمتهم كالعامري وغيره

    "This hadith of Ammar Yasir is proof that the rebel party is Muawiya and his group and the Ali was on the truth and those with him and there is IJMA of ahlesunnat upon this position, stated by al-amiri and others from ahlesunnat."

    2. Imam Muhammad ibn Hasan al-Shaybani (d. 189) a prominent student of Imam Azam and an architect of the hanafi madhab is reported in the Hanafi work, al-jawahir al-mudiyya:

    محمد بن الحسن يقول لو لم يقاتل معاوية عليا ظالما له متعديا باغيا كنا لا نهتدي لقتال أهل البغي

    "If muawiya had not fought with Ali whilst being a zalim/unjust and a rebel/baghi who transgressed then we would not have known the rulings for fighting with rebels."الجواهر-المضية-في-طبقات-الحنفية-صفحة516

    3. Imam al-manawi states in fayd al-qadeer:

    وقال الإمام عبد القاهر الجرجاني في كتاب الإمامة: أجمع فقهاء الحجاز والعراق من فريقي الحديث والرأي ، منهم مالك والشافعي وأبو حنيفة والأوزاعي والجمهور الأعظم من المتكلمين والمسلمين ، أن علياً مصيب في قتاله لأهل صفين كما هو مصيب في أهل الجمل ، وأن الذين قاتلوه بغاة ظالمون له ، لكن لا يكفَّرون ببغيهم

    "Imam Abdul Qahir al-jurjani states in his book al-imamah that jurisconsults of Hijaz and Iraq from ahl al-hadith and Rayy have unanimously agreed, among them were Malik, Shafi`, Abu Hanifah, al-awzai and the great majority of theologians and muslims that Ali was in the right in Siffin as he was right in jamal and those who fought him were unjust rebels but they were not kafirs on account of their rebellion."

    4. Prominent aqidah text of ahlesunnat taught in darse nizami: sharah al-mawaqif by Imam Sayyid Shareef al-Jurjani

    والذى عليه الجمهور من الامة وهو ان المخطئ قتلة عثمان و محاربو علي فانهما امامان فيحرم القتل و المخالفة قطعا الا ان بعضهم كلقاضي ابي بكر ذهب الى ان هذه التخطية لاتبلغ حد التفسيق و منهم من ذهب الى التفسيق كلشيعة وكثيرمن اصحابنا

    "Upon which the majority of the Ummah are is that those who killed Usman and fought with Ali were in error because they were both rightful imams and it is certainly haram to kill and oppose them. Some like qazi abu bakr considered their error as not reaching fisq but those who considered this as fisq are the shiah and MOST of our scholars."

    5. Imam al-Shafi is reported in al-Itiqad of al-Bayhaqi and Ibn Hajr Makki also quotes Imam Shafi's psoition with regards to Hz Muawiya in tatheer al-janan, page 30: Imam Shafi says that I derived the rulings about REBELS from the battles of Ali with Muwiya.

    6. In the famous hanafi fiqh text al-hidaya it says in the chapter of adb al-qadi:

    to be appointed as a judge by an unjust ruler is allowed...because sahaba became judges for Muawiya whilst the truth was with Ali.

    7. Mulla ali qari al-hanafi says in sharah shifa, volume 2, page 556:

    " Muawiya and his supporters can be called in khata, rebellious, khuruj and fasaad but to send la'nah upon them is not allowed.

    8. Imam abu bakr al-jassas al-hanafi (d. 370 ) in his ahkam al-quran volume 3, page 400 says:

    "Ali Ibn Abi talib fought the rebels with the sword and with him were great sahaba and people of badr and he was on the right with fighting them and no one thinks otherwise except for the rebel party and their supporters and the Prophet(saww) told Ammar that you will be killed by the rebels and this hadith is mutawatir"

    9. Imam Shawkani in his nayl al-awtar:

    "there is evidence in this that Ali ibn Abi talib and those with him were in the right and Muawiya and those with him were in falsehood. this is such a matter that no just person can deny it but only the prejuidiced will deny it. the hadith of Ammar yasir being killed by rebels is sufficient for this and this hadith is sahih"

    ( أولاهما بالحق ) فيه دليل على أن عليا ومن معه هم المحقون ، ومعاويةومن معهم هم المبطلون ، وهذا أمر لا يمتري فيه منصف ولا يأباه إلا مكابر متعسف ، وكفى دليلا على ذلك الحديث . وحديث " يقتل عمارا الفئة الباغية " وهو في الصحيح .

    10. the opinion of hazrat Ammar ibn Yasir (ra):

    He was one of the earliest muslims. Born in the same year as the Prophet(s) and His mother was the first shahid in Islam. He was from the muhajiroun and took part in badr. His opinion about those who fought Imam Ali:

    ان عماراً قال لا تقولوا اهل الشام كفروا و لكن قولوا فسقوا او ظلموا

    Do not call the Shaamis kafir but say that they are fasiq (sinners) and zalim (unjust). ( sunan bayhaqi volume 8, page 174)

    انّ عماراً حلف انً قوم معاوية لو قاتلوا قوم علي حتى بلغوا سهفات هجر فما شكوا انّ علياً امامهم الحق و ضده على الباطل

    Ammar Ibn Yasir took an oath that if muawiya fights Ali then there is no doubt that ALi is on truth and Muwaiya on falsehood.

    (Musnad Imam Ahmed, volume 3, page 319, Majma al-zawaid, volume 7, page 223)

    11. in al-istiab by ibn abdil barr it is reported from hazrat abdullah ibn umar:

    I do not regret anything more than the fact that I did not fight against the rebel group (mentioned in hadith of Ammar Yasir above).

    These are prominent personalities of ahl al-Sunnat who have declared those who fought Hazrat Ali ibn Abi Talib as Zaalim Baghis Unjust Rebels. This does not mean they were kafir but muslims. We follow the opinion of these great Sunni Imams and reject the Nasibis who arguing that to believe other than Ijtihadi ghalti is not a Sunni position.
  16. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    Fair point. I won't present the excuse that i find the speaker repulsive and didn't bother remembering his full utterance properly. You scored a full 100 points there. Now you know what to do with them.
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  17. Nawazuddin

    Nawazuddin Veteran

    haha... only a jahil would confuse صدق الله العلي العظيم with صدق الله العظيم.
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  18. Nawazuddin

    Nawazuddin Veteran

    I am no angel dear brother but one thing I must tell you that we all have to go to our graves and I have never knowingly attributed anything falsely to anyone let alone The Imams of our Deen (as) such as Imam Zayn al-Abidin (as). Imam abu al-hasan al-ashari's statement of fact about the son of Imam zayn al-abidin's position of Imam Ali's tafdil is sufficient in the matter to disprove your bakwas. furthermore, About Tafzil-issue, there are detailed evidences and discussions unanswered and the latest one is two-and-half -hours long "masla-e-afzaliyyat" in urdu on utube and soon in-shaa-Allah a detailed discussion on Ijma will be presented and I am sure it will further enlighten you and your nasibi teachers.
  19. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    Only the really gullible will accept a jahil who cannot even pronounce صدق الله العظيم properly
  20. AbdalQadir

    AbdalQadir time to move along! will check pm's.

    The ugly rafidi offspring of mut3ah, enemies of deen, have always been trying unsuccessfully to propagate that there is some sort of an anti-Sayyid conspiracy by scholars or sahaba and so on. And to push this disgraceful lie and win sympathy from sheeple, these devils pretend to be Sayyids and cry their crocodile tears about how they're being victimized*, so that they can spread their corrupt religion. But Alhamdulillah Muslim scholars including Sayyids have exposed these imposters for what they are.

    * real Sayyids and Ahle Bayt have never played the victim card with all this boohoohoo woe is me stuff like how the closet rafidis do, even when they were wronged.
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2016
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