mufti nizamuddin's Fatwa on Obaidullah Azmi

dear brother, after the last exchange, i assume we withdrew from this.

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prove is a very strong word. i consider it to be wrong because i believe that obaidullah's ram-bhakti speech has kufri kalimat and mufti nizamuddin's fatwa absolves him.

you said you would not engage until the story of the first fatwa - v1 and v2 etc. was told by others. i told you that i don't know. as for demanding it from inquisitive, you have done it. you did not reveal the suspense and after a heated exchange, you went silent.

now you have come back asking more questions. (please note i have not asked you any questions). my position

i suggest you do your research - it is the speech that i have referred to.

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i try to be as open as i can and i have mentioned my thoughts in this thread; including many places why i think mufti nizamuddin sahib's fatwa is wrong. i do not understand your new initiative, nor do i want to guess what might be the reason.

i believe obaidullah khan's speech at ram-katha is ugly, and kufriyat. i believe that any self-respecting muslim should refute it - and ulama of ashrafiyah who signed the second fatwa (i.e., mufti nizamuddin's fatwa) should have at least warned people and the mustafti to not repeat such a thing, even if they believed that they could absolve obaidullah from kufr. a mufti's responsibility is not just to issue a fatwa and get done with it - he also gives advice and is mindful that the fatwa can become a precedent for such events in the future.

Allah ta'ala knows best.

 

SS you are back again without telling your-side story. So far it is only you who has been only asking questions.

 

Don't tempt the forum genie...you might just regret it.

 

Brainwashed....

 

Can you please explain which "second' speech you have mentioned here? I ask this, because after the first speech from which istifta was sent by " Abdullah" to scholars at Nagpur conference, there have been two more speeches of Obaidullah Khan which has been uploaded on your forum. First, a clipping in which Abdur rahman tabani ( from malegaon ) explains the wordings of Obaidullah Khan and second , a speech at Urs of Hafize millat.

Kindly pin point as to which speech you mean when you write " this second speech'.

 

Let us not discuss why I am doing and what my intentions are.

abu Hasan, please prove that the fatwa of Mufti nizamuddin rizvi is wrong.

Please, don't come back with bundle of questions. You have said that the fatwa is wrong. Now prove it. This should not be difficult. I am here, in sha Allah.

 

Yes. That's a good point that you have put forward. Shocking!

 

What I personally found most shocking was, they were ready to call Sunni Muftis as Kafir if they regarding Obaidullah as a non-Muslim.

 

Very disappointed in Mawlana Ahmad Mishabi Sahib. Thought he was different.

 

And they must also apologize to the Muslim world for misleading them.

 

no problem, you can post there too. at least i finally got some chance to compose my thoughts and posts.

if the mods wish they can transfer all those posts to this thread too (in one sequential string please, so that context is not lost)

for sure, i would have missed a few bits and pieces of what i had in mind, but really, i'm beyond proof-reading and mental exertion right now

 

@AbdalQadir In your analysis of mufti nizam's fatwa you have brought up some good points but also left some. I will wait and see if aH points them out otherwise I will. I also wish to respond to the politics and the fatwa alteration part.

i have posted this here to keep that thread clean.

 

That's why it is necessary for Ashrafiya to be cornered and forced to provide fatwa on specific statements (backed by audio & video) uttered by Obaidullah. If they still can't come clear, then they stand indicted (they can't be excused any further of being unaware of his speech contents). This is the only way to plug all escape routes. If they indict Obaidullah of kufr then all is well and good.

Unless this is done, we will see recriminations going back and forth and more bad blood for years to come.

 

Yes

 

What are the chances its not, when the Muftis stayed silent and never objected? Neither before not after.

 

That is just common perennialist talk of hindus that they repeat adhominem on tv [ DOORDARSHAN, ZEE, STAR, ETC ]. The hindu religion is a religion founded on perennialism. Which is a practical contradiction, because historically, hinduism violently destroyed budhism, and suppressed jainism to such an extent that jains started considering themselves as hindus. Then came the shudhi movement of the Muslims and the arya samaj deception and then the mass Quran burning in india.

sikhs are still considered hindus, and even the budhists you can find in Japan and China

The politicians in india want the Muslims, like always, to repeat the perennialist deception of hinduism.

 

Just to clarify - where and when was this speech? Was it recently at Urs e Hafiz e Millat?

 

"mazhab hamesha ek raha hai, ek rahega"

that is millions of kuffriyaat in a single sentence.

إِنَّ الَّذِينَ كَفَرُوا بَعْدَ إِيمَانِهِمْ ثُمَّ ازْدَادُوا كُفْرًا لَّن تُقْبَلَ تَوْبَتُهُمْ وَأُولَٰئِكَ هُمُ الضَّالُّونَ

[A/I`mran 3:90] Indeed those who disbelieve after having accepted faith, and advance further in their disbelief - their repentance will never be accepted; and it is they who are the astray.

UKA is only advancing in his kufr.

 

if this second speech of obaidullah khan is true, and if he indeed sent the cassette to mubarakpur's muftis and they indeed listened to it and then gave that fatwa, then tawbah should be demanded of these muftis too - for they have committed a heinous crime.




sub'HanAllah.

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all his explanations about his attendance at ram-katha is a stretch and a patent lie. if this is not refuted and forcefully refuted, then certainly ashrafiyah will become worse than nadwah; at least they advocate unity of those who say: "la ilaaha illa Allah". here is this obaid who wants you to unite with followers of ram and krishan under the aegis of ashrafiyah!

inna lillahi wa inna ilayhi raji'un.

Allah ta'ala knows best.

 

"I have watered Ahsrafiya not with my sweat but with my blood" - Hafidh-e-Millat ('alayhirrahmah)

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And here is a man standing on the podium and barking the praises of Ram, Krishna and gaurav, pandav - non-existent mythological beings worshipped by hindus - into the microphone.

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Twisting the meaning of jihad. Inside the premises, a stone's throw away from the mazar-shareef.

All the 'ulema' are listening calmly. This is murder of truth in cold-blood. Who will wake them up from this reverie?