So called 'naqshbandi Haqqani' affirming belief in the false prophet known as 'Drew Ali'

Discussion in 'Aqidah/Kalam' started by Inwardreflection, Mar 8, 2021.

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  1. AR Ahmed

    AR Ahmed Well-Known Member

    I request my account be deleted. I cannot be and will not be witness to the slander of a Sunni Naqshbandi shaykh who has passed away. رحمة الله تعلى عليه

    Last edited: Mar 6, 2021
  2. MaturidiNahwi

    MaturidiNahwi New Member

    Jazaak Allahu khayran brother Abu Hasan, may Allah reward you abundantly for your clarification on the statement made by Lokman, and also for pointing out this bid'ah of nazim.

    I've met a number of haqqanis who screech numerous kufriyaat in the name of 'higher levels of knowledge', 'oceans', 'realities' and the list goes on. They've got a cunning way of showing different faces to different people, and they're quite deceptive towards those deemed as 'barelwi'. They've crept their way into barelwi masajid throughout the UK.
    When you present aqeedah to some of these headless ducks, one of the fallacies they'll present is "ulamaa' are at one level, awliya are at another". It's such a disservice and dis-ingenuity to basic human intellect to even say such a statement in justification of kufr. I've heard one 'murid' even say that their 'shuyukh' have higher ranks than prophets and that Qasim Nanotwi speaks of 'realities' in his 'tahzeer'!

    When a person becomes so infatuated with his misguided shaykh, and so-called 'realities', this is the level of kufr it can reach...
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  3. MaturidiNahwi

    MaturidiNahwi New Member

    Made a few blunders in my writing. I wrote this at around 4:30am.
    giving misguidance*
    without saying controversial*
    Nor am I saying that it is wrong to mention the Qur'an*
    rather we leave the meaning to Allah, and we interpret them*
    We don't translate them however, into english words which indicate anthropomorphic meanings.*

    Usually I'd pay more attention to my grammar, but I have rushed posts here and have slipped my fingers in typing after having typed a number of posts I suppose.
  4. abu Hasan

    abu Hasan Administrator

    at the least, it will be classified as ignorance and heresy and utter stupidity. but it is certainly kufr from many aspects. as it contradicts explicit aayat and hadith.

    now people may make ta'wils and 'he meant this', 'he meant that' but will have no bearing. the man is alive and he should be asked to repent and clarify his aqidah that sayyiduna aadam alayhi's salam was the first human to be created and he is the first prophet to be sent forth. and he should apologise for his mistake - and clarify if it was a slip of the tongue or that he was not thinking when he said it or some other plausible reason. regardless, it is obligatory on him to clarify his aqidah and do tawbah.

    most people do not see it in this light, but this is the bid'ah of nazim qubrusi - make wild statements and call it "very high level knowledge". the swagger and the mutasawwif equivalent of: "you cannot see these clothes if you are not intelligent".

    RasulAllah SallAllahu alayhi wa sallam left us on the path illuminated - tarakana `ala maHajjatin bayDaa; layluha ka nahariha - the path is as bright and clear even in the night as if it were daytime.

    wa billahi't tawfiq.
  5. MaturidiNahwi

    MaturidiNahwi New Member

    Watch this video:

    Shaykh Naveed Jameel refutes Dr Musharraf's translation of the Holy Qur'an, and says that the mutashaabihaat cannot be translated literally. He said it contradicts the principles of ahlus sunnah. What did Shaykh Lokman do in his video?

    Now let's look at the Sunni belief, which is that Prophet Adam (alayhis salaam) is the first human, and ofcourse the first Prophet. This is different to what Shaykh Lokman said - that there are many Adams before Prophet Adam (alayhis salaam).
    This is the primer on aqeedah written by Khalifa e Ala Hazrat, Sadr-ul-Afaadil, Shaykh Sayyid Naeemuddeen Muraadabaadi. The translation has been done by Mawlana Abu Hasan. Have a look at page 7. It clearly mentions that "The first prophet to come in this world is also the first human: Sayyiduna Aadam (alayhis salaam)."
    I have to quote a primer in aqeedah because this basic aqeedah has somehow skipped your mind, osmanlinaqshbandirizvi. You gave a ta'weel which was extremely far fetched saying he was referring to Sayyidunaa Muhammad (sal Allahu alayhi wa sallam) as the last Adam, and the prophets who came before as the 'earlier Adams'. I showed how this made no sense, because he claimed this was a 'secret knowledge', and it is no secret knowledge that there were many prophets (the exact number Allah knows best) before the Prophet Muhammad (sal Allahu alayhi wa sallam). Therefore it is clear that Lokman meant this in a literal sense, and doesn't know basic aqeedah.
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2021
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  6. MaturidiNahwi

    MaturidiNahwi New Member

    You're not geting the point. I'm getting tired myself. You keep talking about Shaykh Mehmet. You're diverting. What I mentioned was Shaykh Hisham, Shaykh Lokman, Shaykh Gibril, and the eshaykh people who are giving misguided.
    I didn't even discuss Shaykh Mehmet in the beginning.
    Shaykh Mehmet is not the only person that people listen to in the tariqah, that's a reality that you have to come to realise. There are other people who are listened to, like the individuals mentioned above. People get misguided by them, too.
    Also, countless people like Mufti Akhtar Raza Khan have shown that you can teach MILLIONS of people without saying contraversial, deviant statements.
    I am not rejecting the verse of the Qur'an. Nor am I saying that it is wrong to mention a qur'an.
    If you know anything about aqeedah, we do tafwid and ta'weel, we don't literally translate the mutashaabihaat, rather we leave the meaning to Allah, or we interpret them. We don't translate them however into english words which indicate anthropomorphic meanings.
    Also, you naming a number of books of the ahlus sunnah shows that you know the names of the books of ahlus sunnah. What about people who have perennialist aqeedah?
    If you had aqeedah in the best interests, you would've said I agree with you that more focus and effort needs to be put on refuting perennialist kufr! Instead you keep trying to divert to the people that don't promote perennialist kufr, and ignore those who do promote perennialist kufr. Ignoring a problem only gives it the opportunity to grow and spread.
    You mention the rizvis who praise Tahir ul, and who praise Ibn taymiyyah and have mistakes in their salah. Show me one of the rizvi shuyukh doing this. You won't be able to. However here I am presenting to you haqqani 'shuyukh' that are promoting bid'ah.
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  7. “And when I have proportioned him and breathed into him of My [created] soul, then fall down to him in prostration” [Quran al-Hijr 15:29].

    So Hojja Lokman Effendi (Hafizullah) is wrong for narrating a verse from the Quran? La hawla wala quwatta Ila bi Allah. The Rizvis should be ashamed of you

    As Ahle sunnah wa al jamaat we accept Allah is free from creation and when hand, breath, face is mentioned in the Quran then it is metaphorical as stated in Bahar e Shariat, Ihya ulum ad din, Jaal Haq, Futu al Gayb, Fiqh al Akbar etc. You say us Haqqanis dont know about Shariat and Aqeeda, Then what's this ^^. We even quote from the ones who you claim to follow, if anything we are more Rizvi than you.

    You are no Rizvi, your a Ghustakhe Awliya Fasiq Jahil. Here in your own lack of understanding you tried to attack Hoja Lokman Effendi for quoting the Quran. Subhaan Allah.

    I dont know to laugh or cry for you. Just because some arrogant Jahil mureeds made some wrong statements within our Haqqani silsila. Then you label the whole Tariqa bad??

    We have come across Rizvis calling Tahir ul Qadri Sheikh ul Islam, praising Ibn Taymiya, making many mistakes in salah and tajweed as well as simple Tafsir of the Quran. Yet we NEVER labeled the whole Rizvi Barlevi Tariqa as weak in Aqeeda like you. However YOU are some next level Sheikh who knows how to prevent Kuffar by attacking other Sheikhs.

    Mufti Shamsul Huda is waiting for you call. If you are sincere then go the whole way Sheikh
  8. Noor11

    Noor11 New Member

    My brother I’m getting really tired of this now honestly , your responses are not even responses . I’m giving you clear cut evidence what shaykh Muhammad says you jump to another man ...

    Brother the truth is you want everyone to think like you and to be like you . That’s not going to happen .

    “ they don’t learn book knowledge and are very against it “

    brother where do you get this rubbish from , I’ve spoken to many people who claim to follow this tariqa , yes they say kufri stuff because of their sheer ignorance !

    Most of these mans who your talking about are those who are only in Islam simply because of the love they have towards mawlana shaykh RadiAllahu anh don’t you see how fragile their faith is ?!

    brother don’t say rubbish like “ the figureheads don’t teach “

    I’ve witnessed on many accounts shaykh has told people to go learn Their fard ul ayn , I am doing this currently I go to classes of different scholars and we learn from them , what you fail to understand is these people will never learn Islam

    You have Born Muslims who don’t know nothing and your trying to get reverts to do it.

    There’s two types of laws , those for the strong and those for the weak . The sahaba Alayhim Ridwan had 23 years With RasulAllah SalAllahu Alayhi Wasalam . 23 years of tarbiyah but somehow Muslims who convert to Islam or Muslims of today’s day and age must learn Islam and the laws quick time ....

    Brother all your going to do is burn out people and make them run away from this deen .

    Abdullah ibn Amr reported: A man came to the Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, and he said, “O Messenger of Allah, I recite the Quran but I do not find that my heart understands it.” The Prophet said, “Verily, your heart is filled with faith, and faith is given to a servant before the Quran.”

    Jundub ibn Abdullah reported: We were with the Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, while we were strong young boys. We learned faith before we learned the Quran, then we learned the Quran and it strengthened our faith.

    Sunan Ibn Mājah 61

    This is a day and age of apostasy , people leaving this deen all together .

    this is not the time where your going to get great scholars emerging . This is last of days and I hope people just die upon Emaan Faith .

    law will only make someone run away if faith is not grounded in the hearts .

    those who shaykh Nazim RadiAllahu anh collected , no tariqa would take them in , why because they have absolutely no clue about Islam . Islam to them is just to say Lailaha ilallah Muhammadur RasoolAllah .

    You don’t know how weak and fragile peoples Emaan is in today’s day and age . Your understanding of religion will make people run away not because your wrong but because of your harshness and to much emphasis on the law to a people who not let faith settle in to their hearts .

    Ill leave you with this .. I can’t be bothered to go back and forth on this . Understand the time your living in .

    once a follower came to shaykh Nazim and said “ I’m going to a Jewish lady and I’m learning kabala, I got inspiration from you to go to her “

    Mawlana shaykh RadiAllahu anh said to him stop going there it is haram ! We don’t accept their teaching of the Jews ...

    this man continued on his way and would still go back to that woman .
    One of the brothers said to Mawlana , why don’t you dismiss him and send him away and tell him to never come back .

    Mawlana shaykh responded

    “ if I send him away , he will be a full on Jew , I keep him here because I don’t want him to lose La Ilaha Ilallah Muhammadur RasoolAllah”

    in sha Allah he will leave that woman! even I’ve said to him 10 times not go it’s haram and prayer is not accepted on the one learns this knowledge, in his arrogance he will still go .

    We are living in strange times

    I will leave this discussion with this Hadith . Reflect on it .

    Hudhayfah ibn al-Yaman (radi Allahu anhu) narrated that the Prophet (sal Allahu alaihi wa sallam) said: “Islam will wear out as embroidery on a garment wears out, until no one will know what fasting, prayer, (pilgrimage) rites and charity are. The Quran will disappear in one night, and not one verse of it will be left on earth. And there will be some people left, old men and old women who will say, ‘We saw our fathers saying these words: la ilaha illa Allah, so we say them too.’”

    “Silah asked Hudhayfah, ‘What will saying la ilaha illa Allah do for them when they do not know what prayer, fasting, (pilgrimage) rites and charity are?’ Hudhayfah ignored him; then Silah repeated his question three times, and each time Hudhayfah ignored him. Finally he answered, ‘O Silah, it will save them from Hell,’ and said it three times.” [The Chapters on Tribulations: Sunan Ibn Majah]
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2021
  9. Khanah

    Khanah Active Member

    With reference to the hadith mentioned below, my understanding was that it was talking about children. The hukm about not touching a woman is referring to adults. It's the same way you don't need to have hijab in front of a child but you do when he reaches maturity.

    Secondly, there are certain rules which are different for the Prophet of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him and different for the ummah. There are several examples that the ulema have mentioned and they are taken into consideration when deriving rulings from hadith in the same way abrogation etc is taken into consideration.

    In any case, I believe this debate is extremely futile. I do not believe either side will change their opinion so you're just wasting your time. I think there is enough information in this thread for the casual observer to make up their own mind now- I know I've made up mine.

    Jazak Allah khair
  10. MaturidiNahwi

    MaturidiNahwi New Member

    You're failing to comprehend. I already know him, and the Shaykh Hisham group are not the main branch of the naqshbandi haqqanis. But they ARE figureheads. They are deemed as shaykhs by atleast a large group of people and their misguidance is prevalent, and they are followed by people. There isn't any doubt about that. Just because they are not the main group of naqshbandi haqqanis, it doesn't mean they don't have a large influence, and that they don't spread confusion and misguidance and in some cases kufr beliefs like some which are hinted towards in answers written on eshaykh.

    Figurehead doesn't mean they have full authority. It means they're in a position of influence within the dimensions and dynamics of the tariqah.

    I've spoken to and met people from the osmanlis, nazimiyyas, and haqqanis, and in each group I have found followers who speak words of kufr and misguidance. And whenever I refute this, they use the words of their shaykhs as justification. This shows that the sunni aqeedah has not been made clear-cut. If people are using vague and dodgy statements of people in positions of authority to justify their kufr and their bid'ah, then clearly there's an issue?

    Also, let's face it. Many followers of the naqshbandi haqqani tariqah have a cult-like mentality and don't listen to anybody other than their shaykh. They don't learn the basics of the religion and then they go on to derive whatever aqeedah they feel like from the statements of their shaykhs. This is often due to many of the shaykhs not placing any emphasis on fard 'uloom and talking too much about 'realities' and 'oceans' and so-on. They have a very negative mentality towards books of 'ilm.
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  11. Noor11

    Noor11 New Member

    No my brother he is not , this is why I’m telling you , you don’t know what and who has been given permission by shaykh Muhammad.

    go ask him yourself .. the osmanli jamat is their own jamat not from the main jamat .
  12. MaturidiNahwi

    MaturidiNahwi New Member

    Lokman is a figurehead. You as a follower of Shaykh Mehmet won't see that. The reality is, is that under the umbrella of 'naqshbandi haqqani', he's there somewhere.
  13. Noor11

    Noor11 New Member

    Also you keep saying the figure heads, sayyid taajush shariah put the Amamah sharif over the head sayyed irfan shah , you are aware of what has recently transpired . If ceratain people do mistakes we don’t blame the figure

    lukam is responsible for what he says not shaykh Muhammad nor is shaykh Nazim RadiAllahu anh responsible.

    Also regarding the Jews and Christians Mawlana shaykh position on them is clear .

    and on hell fire being for eternity is clear.

    Just two weeks ago I will present you with the suhba of shaykh Muhammad


    ● In the end believers will have the last laugh

    “There is a verse in the Holy Qur’an which says, those without faith were mocking and laughing at the faithful. They think they were doing something useful [and] when they went back to their own people and communities, they were all happy. This is how Allah ﷻ describes and tells us about them. These unbelievers, infidels think [they] are something special and hate, mock and humiliate the believers. They do all sorts of actions and think they are doing something special or important, they see themselves as higher or as a more elite class. They like to use other people as they like as if it were their right to do so. However, in the hereafter the mu’mins (believers) will laugh at these unbelieving infidels. They say, ‘The one who laughs last, laughs the [most],’ so in the end it is the believers who will laugh at their state and end, because of all the things they have done thinking they were the most intelligent, clever and learned people. They did not accept the truth and followed shaytan so Muslims and mu’mins will laugh at them because at that time they [will] have nothing to laugh about. For eternity they [will suffer] torture they will be crying and yelling, they will spend such a life it will be never-ending, continuous.

    Therefore, those who mock you in this world [because they] do not like the type [of person you are] or your clothes; there are going to be many people like that, they laugh and say, ‘What kind of modernity is this? What kind of clothes are you wearing? Look how you are acting.’ There are many who laugh and [say] this yet these clothes, actions are for the sake of Allah ﷻ, they are done for His satisfaction. Those who laugh like this in the end will regret it and be sorry. ‘In the way of Allah,’ our Holy Prophet ﷺ says. On this path of Allah ﷻ we are not going to worry whether they will laugh or mock us, there is no need to be sad. Everybody can [dress] and roam around as they like just because you are wearing modern clothes and nobody is laughing at you, nobody should laugh at you if you are wearing dervish clothes. We need to be careful of this Allah ﷻ is watching all of us, our end will be in the presence of Allah ﷻ. Those who win in the end will be the mu’mins therefore there is no need to be sad, distressed or embarrassed. If there is anyone who should be ashamed it is those who are disobeying Allah’s ﷻ commands and orders, their end will be at loss it will not be good if they do not repent. May Allah ﷻ give us health, wellbeing and give our faith strength insha’Allah.”

    -- Mawlana Shaykh Muhammad Adil ق

  14. Mufti Shams ul Huda has requested for you to contact him. He is aware of your accusations and claims. Since you have taken the position of a Sheikh and you want to save the masses from Kuffar by attacking the Awliya. I suggest you follow it up and go the full way if you are a true Barelvi upon the Maslak e Ala Hazrat رضي الله عنه

    He said contact him on this number: 01924409786
    He is available from 5pm-8pm Monday to Friday

    IF that is not enough. Then we will give you the number of the Khalifa of Tajusharia in UK. He will also give you a solid answer. You have taken the position of a Sheikh, you are responsible for all you have said, now enforce your claims.
  15. MaturidiNahwi

    MaturidiNahwi New Member

    If you read your post, and then go back to watch the video, you will realise you haven't answered the objection. Also, the first hadith shareef you quoted was also quoted earlier on, however like I said before I cannot just derive a ruling from that. Go back to the video, where Shaykh Nazim actually claims the angels don't write down his deeds. This is a huge issue.
    This opens the door towards making people believe that a Muslim is no longer mukallaf to follow the shari'ah past the age of 80.

    Also, as stated before, Shaykh Mehmet is a lot more balanced than the others. However, there are many people who are devout followers of Shaykh Lokman, and they will take this 'ruling' that has been mentioned. I've heard myself from osmanlis personally also, that they've enquired from 'senior murids' in their circle who have told them that the shaykh says pray nawafil in place of missed prayers and you don't need to make up missed prayers...

    I feel like Shaykh Mehmet's study with damascene ulama kept him more balanced than others. Shaykh Lokman is not an alim, and he doesn't have understandings of basic rulings yet he has authority and leadership. His mistakes must be corrected, he must retract and public mistakes, and humble himself to go learn fard uloom and more.

    Any learned brothers, perhaps even Mawlana Abu Hasan if he sees this, what is the hukm on believing that there were multiple Adams before our Prophet Adam?
    What is the hukm on one laughing along with an insult of a prophet?
    And what is the hukm of one saying saying Allah blew 1 'holy breath' into Prophet Adam?

    The above 3 are issues with Shaykh Lokman, and are very contentious.
    abu Hasan likes this.
  16. Noor11

    Noor11 New Member

    As for accountability . Allah is my witness ! Shaykh Mawlana RadiAllahu anh never considered himself not accountable but when he swore at the wahabis saying “kharah Alaykum “

    Yes indeed it is not a sin to curse those who disparage the Prophet SalAllahu Alayhi Wasalam .

    the Hadith the shaykh was referring to was this ....

    The following is related on the authority of Anas ibn Malik, Allah is pleased with him: The Messenger of God, blessings and peace upon him said:
    "For a newborn child until he reaches the age of discretion, his good deeds are written to the credit of his parents, while his bad deeds are written neither against him nor against his parents. Once he reaches the age of discretion and the pen begins to write [his acts], God the Exalted issues His command to the two angels who accompany him and guard and counsel him.
    When he reaches forty years in Islam, God gives him security from three [things]: madness, leprosy and vitiligo.
    When he reaches fifty, God makes his reckoning lighter
    When he reaches sixty, God grants him to revert to Him as pleases Him.
    When he reaches seventy, the inhabitants of Heaven love him
    When he reaches eighty, God records his good acts and is lenient with his bad ones.
    When he reaches ninety, God forgives him his bygone sins and those to come, allows him to intercede on behalf of his family, and he becomes God's prisoner on the earth .
    Then should he be returned to the worst age, so that after having had knowledge he knows nothing, God continues to record as good acts for him those which he used to do knows nothing. God continues to record as good acts for him those which he used to do when he was well, and if he commits an evil act it is not recorded."

    This hadith is mentioned by Shaykh Ahmad ibn Ali ibn Abil Qasim al Yamani among the forty hadith has collected regarding the forgiveness of sins that had gone by and sins to come.
    A man dies in accordance with what he had lived in, and is resurrected in accordance with what he had died in. [Hadith]

    The angels do not stop recording. However, a hadith qudsi states: “I feel shy to punish My servant who has worshipped me for 70 years.”

    shaykh Mawlana always kept his prayers , even extra nawafil ibaadah he would do .

    He would always take Azimah instead of Ruqsa to himself .

    Also a speech on this very hadith was done by mufti fazl Ahmed chishti

    where one reaches old age Allah blesses him with certain blessing because of being in this cursed world .

    Of those he mentioned his reckoning and bad deeds are omitted and his good deeds which he done before and how he lived still continue on , even if he can’t do any more of those good deeds due to old age .

    also regarding Qada prayers

    shaykh Muhammad stance is well known on this , he even said it just recently in a suhba

    “ if there are people who don’t pray at all , we recommend they pray atleast two rakats daily so they make a habit of Praying . Once they make the habit of praying they can then make us the prayers they have missed previously “

    You can go and ask shaykh Muhammad himself .

    Also with regards to the statements of other who say they on this tariqa . We have no responsibility for them .

    lokman is not a representative of shaykh Muhammad this is clear . Even osmanli will even admit to this .

    with regards to many Prophet Adam’s Alayhi MusalAm

    This is from the Futuhat al-Makkiyya of Muhyiddine ibn `Arabi; see al-Sha`rani al-Yawaqit wal-Jawahir on this issue. It is not an integral part of a Muslim’s `Aqidah
  17. MaturidiNahwi

    MaturidiNahwi New Member

    Allah knows best whether the pope has accepted Islam.

    I am well aware Shaykh Mehmet doesn't shake the hands of women. Out of Shaykh Mehmet, I've found him to be the strictest out of the haqqani shuyukh. It's common knowledge that a form of zina is to touch a non-mahram woman. And you're saying that shaking of the hands is excused for the elderly.
    What fatwa are you providing? I can't derive a ruling from a hadith mubarak that you've presented to me - giving a ruling is not as simple as that. I don't have those expertise.
    Also, the issue is more than women shaking the hands of their shaykhs. Additionally, it is also kissing the hands. There are muridas kissing the hands still, of people like Shaykh Hisham.
  18. Noor11

    Noor11 New Member

    2 . Kissing hands or shaking hands

    Many scholars asked Mawlana shaykh About this , Mawlana shaykh himself would say when I was in Damascus I never shook hands with women but only when I was sent to the western countries I allowed it out of mercy .

    some scholars of today have even cited Evidence of what situations this can
    Place .

    but you saying the mere touch of the hand constitutes of zina , I’ve never heard of that before . Shaykh only allowed it for the him to be easily approachable and to bring these people into Islam . This is why you see most of his mureeds are reverts . His dawah in the west has towered many others . Even the salafis would admit this .

    I would like to pay your attention first , this is only for elderly men and elderly women .

    yes there are Ulemah who have had a strict position on this , that is the stronger position.

    I would like to ask you what do you about the narrations of slave girls of Madinah Al Munawwara taking the blessing hands of the messenger of Allah and would take the messenger where ever they wanted

    Anas bin Malik said, "Any of the female slaves of Medina could take hold of the hand of Allah's Messenger SalAllahu Alayhi Wasalam and take him wherever she wished." (Bukhari)

    Anas bin Malik said: “If a female slave among the people of Medinah were to take the hand of the Messenger of Allah SalAllahu Alayhi Wasalam , he would not take his hand away from hers until she had taken him wherever she wanted in Medinah so that her needs may be met.” (Ibn Majah, Ahmed)

    Also you will hear from our illustrious Ulemah of the past , how they acted and behaved

    Ibrahim al-Nikhae said, "I met a woman and I intended to shake my hands with her. I placed my hand over the cloth and she took of her niqab, She was one of the woman of my area who became middle aged. I shook my hand with her and I didn't have anything on my hand." (حلية الأولياء 2/442)

    Narrations that appear to prohibit touching a non-mahram use the term mass (touch) to metaphorically refer to sexual acts so do Not apply to the issue of shaking hands.


    Shaking hands between men and women who are not mahram without desire is permitted by some jurists - most however prohibit the practice.

    I would like add , the son of shaykh Nazim Al Haqqani RadiAllahu Anh does not shake hands of women . They don’t allow it themselves .
  19. Noor11

    Noor11 New Member

    This is in response to brother maturidi Nahwi

    I am speaking as a mureed of As sayyed shaykh Muhammad Adil . I’ve been a mureed of shaykh Nazim Al Haqqani RadiAllahu anh and his son and only representative shaykh Muhammad Adil .

    As for shaykh Adnan Kabbani and shaykh hisham they are mureeds of GrandShaykh Shaykh Abdullah Al Faiz Ad Daghestani RadiAllahu anh

    One thing I’ve noticed , you have overzealous Mureeds and overzealous students who jump to conclusions when they know only half of the matter .

    this is going to be quite long but it is in need of a response .

    1. Mawlana shaykh Nazim Al Haqqani meeting with the pope

    Do you know why the meeting took place ?

    The pope at that time said many harsh and terrible things about Islam , also in Cyprus there’s a feud between the Turks and the Greeks . So much so , the Greeks where taking holy makams sites and dating sites , meeting up their girlfriends and having sexual intercourse outside the makams .

    shaykh Nazim’s family are the main care takers of the makams of all the sites in Cyprus , this is why when you go there , the naqshbandi Taaj is seen on all of them .

    Even before this , the pope wanted to meet shaykh Nazim but shaykh Nazim rejected the invitation and gave him a response to his foolish words , I have the suhbah present and I will post it ...

    Subhan Allah like a true wali of Allah mawlan shaykh spoke out against the pope when many where silent in Cyprus and in turkey ..

    Concerning The Present Pope's Remarks On Islam

    Audhu bi-llahi mina shaitani rajim,
    Audhu bi-llahi mina shaitani rajim,
    Audhu bi-llahi mina shaitani rajim,
    Bismillahir Rahmanir-Rahim,
    Bismillahir Rahmanir-Rahim,
    Bismillahir Rahmanir-Rahim

    Assalamu alaikum, servants of the Lord of Heavens. . . .
    I hear that the Chief of the Western Church (the Pope) is so keen to dress Islam with a new dressing. Their heads are like rocks. They think that with their dresses they are changing. If they are wearing something on their heads or on their shoulders they think that they are trying to become someone else. They are thinking that titles are giving them something and these titles have been invented by them. They think that the titles that they use like Catholics or Orthodox or Christian World are going to give them something from people. Recently the Chief of the Catholic Church was speaking something which was beyond our mentality and beyond our mind. What I mean is that our mentalities can never accept what they are saying. Still they claim that their ways are the most suitable for the minds and the understanding of people. This is hundred percent (100%) wrong.
    How can they say these things and what is the principal behind it? I hear that the Pope has been saying that Islamic principals have been forced on the minds of people. That Islamic principals are making the minds of people to be hard and different. What he is meaning to say is that Islam is not suitable for the minds of people but that Christianity is more in keeping with the minds and mentality of the people. How can he say this? Which principal of Christianity is the mind or mentality of people accepting? For example whose mind or mentality will accept their claim that the Lord of Heavens was killed on a cross. How can a mind accept this? How can the people of the 21st century accept that God can be crucified? What stupidity is this? Still the Pope says that Christianity is closer to the understanding of the people than Islam is.

    Who is giving the Pope this authority with which he speaks? Maybe someone will say that he is a crazy one or that he is so very old and therefore he is demented for saying such a wrong thing, for seeing wrong as right and right as wrong. He must be a crazy person. Some people are seeing red and some even look green because of what they say. How can the Lord of Heavens be crucified by his creatures. What type of mentality will accept this? But still the Pope is finding a way to talk about this. Because of this understanding the Christians are making the cross everywhere and also making the cross to be sacred.

    The axe is cutting a person's head and then the people take the axe and kiss it saying, "Oh axe you cut our Lord's head." Yes, they kiss the cross that killed Christ. This is their mentality. How can sane people accept this mentality? The only conclusion that people can have of the one who is having such a mentality is that he should be taken away. Yes the Pope should be taken away because it appears that he has lost his mind and mentality and people who have a sound mind or mentality cannot ever accept his words.

    They also say that "Jesus is Lord", "Lord of creation". Was Jesus not carried in the womb of Mary? He was inside her womb with so many things, which are like sewage channels inside the womb. If you cut open the womb you will find that there are so many things inside the womb that makes it look like a sewage channel. Therefore their mentality is to say that the Lord of Heavens was for a period of nine months inside this sewage channel. This is what the Christians are claiming about the Lord of Heavens. This is their mentality and the Christians are claiming that their mentality is the most suitable for the human race.

    Talking of what is suitable for the human mentality, there is still another point in the Christian principles which I would like to point out. From where does a child arrive into this world? Is it from the front side or the backside of the person giving birth. If one is to say it is from the backside this would be worse than if it is from the front side. Or is the child coming out of the mother's mouth. Jesus was born of Mary like other children were born. Yet they say in this manner did the Lord of Heavens come to the Earth. This is the mentality that Christians claim is suitable to the human mind. Was Jesus a perfect man
    when he was born or was he a child. Virgin Mary was carrying him and showing him to people so it means that he was born a child. Funny it is, to say that the Lord of Heavens was a little baby like other children. Or are they now trying to say that he came out of his mother with a beard and say to her "Mary, I am your Lord so do Sajda and prostrate to me". Is this the mentality that Christianity claims is more suitable to the human mind than Islam is.

    Then we come into yet another point. We know that mother Mary breast fed the child Jesus. This is their mentality that the Lord of Heavens has to be breast-fed. Very good. This is what the Pope means by Christianity being closer to the understanding of man. Yet again I would like to ask was the baby cleaned by the mother both in front and from behind (cleaning urine and faeces). If it is so as they claim then this child who is the Lord of Heavens was cleaned by his mother in this manner. Is this acceptable of the Lord of Heavens. Such is the mentality of Christianity and the Pope that they claim that the Lord of Heavens was born off a woman, born of Mariam. What is this nonsense? The most important characteristic of the Lord of Heavens is to be Powerful and not to be weak. It is impossible for God to be weak in front of His creatures. Is this true or is this false.

    Why was Jesus running away from his persecutors if he was the Lord and had the Power of the Lord? Why was he trying to run away from his creatures? Lord means that He is the Creator. This means that he feared that his enemies would harm him. This is certainly not becoming of the Lord of Heavens. The Creator trying to escape from His creation is to say the least not of sound reasoning and still the Pope is claiming that Christianity is more in conformity with sense and sensibility. The Pope must be getting old and deteriorating in his mental health and therefore making everything upside down.

    Then again there is still another point about Christianity that does not seen to be sensible to a person with a good mentality and mind. How can the Lord of Heavens be eating and drinking like others do. Even the angels are privileged enough not to eat and drink and still the Christians claim that the Lord of Heavens needed to eat and drink because Jesus ate and drank during his lifetime in this world. This is what Christianity teaches and it is shameful to teach such teachings. Yes, according to them the Lord of Heavens is even weaker than the angels and so needs to eat and drink. The Pope should be ashamed to state that Christianity is more in tune with the human mind and mentality than Islam.

    I am also asking the Pope why is it that the Lord of Heavens that you believe in needs to go to the toilet. This cannot be if he is the Lord of Heavens. The Germans are also no mind people because they are taking the Pope to be for the German people and the Italians are also very sad with the new Pope because they want the Pope to be Italian after the Polish Pope. Who are the people who appoint the Pope? Is the Pope appointed by the Heavens or by the Cardinals? Was this title of Pope granted by the Heavens or was it given by the cardinals? This highest rank is granted by the Cardinals and not by the Heavens. Even so some of the Cardinals are against the appointment of this particular Pope. Some Cardinals say that he is good and some other Cardinals believe that he is not good.

    I am asking these Cardinals, "was your Lord eating and drinking?" and they answer, "yes, he was not an angel therefore he was eating and drinking." Then I ask them, "does he need to go to the toilet because when someone eats and drinks something must also come out." To this question they cannot answer, "no." Yes it is blame on them for making the Lord of Heavens to enter the toilet. This then is their mentality and this too in this 21st century and still the Pope says that Christianity is more in keeping with sound mentality and mind than Islam. What can we say. Yes, what can we say. This means that they have lost their understanding and they have lost their mentality. Yes, they have lost their minds. They have also lost their knowledge. I do not know how else to describe them.

    They are however saying so many things against the Seal of Prophets and still the Seal of Prophets never said "I am your Lord." He was instead saying, "I am the servant of my Lord." Christianity says that Jesus is the Lord of Heavens and Islam says that Muhammad is the servant of the Lord of Heavens, now which of these two statements seem like being more closer to the truth and understanding of the mind and mentality of mankind. But the Christains are not ashamed of saying such things and this is why the Islamic world is getting up and attacking them. Why is this? This is because Islam is the right way. They say that Islam was using the sword. Yes, we were ordered to use the sword against Shaitan and the Shaitanic groups who were against the truth. The followers of Shaitan have their ways and these ways are like the ways of dragons. We use the sword against dragons and not against everyone. No. They are blaming us that we used the sword and say that Islam was spread by the sword.

    Did Jesus Christ use a knife or a sword? It is forbidden in Christianity to use the sword, but then how are the Christians of today using the sword and have been using the sword for the past 2000 years. In Islam it is not forbidden to use the sword and therefore even if I were to carry a knife or use the sword it is allowed. But how can Christians use this when they have been forbidden to do so. They are killing each other today and have been doing so for the past 2000 years and yet it is forbidden for them to use the sword as Jesus never advocated the use of the sword. If they are real followers of Jesus Christ it is not possible for them to even carry a knife. But they are making all kinds of weapons that is used to kill people and to destroy humanity on earth. Yes, you can witness this now.

    Why is the Pope not blaming all these Christian nations and instead blaming Islam? These nations are today killing and burning and destroying everything, but still the Pope is silent about these things and is blaming Islam saying that it was spread by the sword. The Pope is simply not speaking the truth. Islam did use the sword to take away tyrants and shaitanic groups in order to prevent these groups from harming people. We used it for this purpose. Why are they not blaming Moses, as he was using the sword. Why do they not blame David who was both a king and a Prophet. Did he not use the sword? But they attack Islam. Islam is perfect. In spite of these people attacking Islam, Islam remains as the perfect religion. These people are born to refuse Islam and to be enemies of Islam.

    Allah Almighty gave power to the Seal of Prophet. Before he was born his father passed away and this was while he was still in the womb of his mother. His mother passed away when he was only four years old. He was an orphan and he had no armies, no power, no money, no treasures and everyone was attacking him when he began to preach Islam. They were asking to harm him and to defeat him. They were asking that he be killed. The Lord of Heavens told him, "Oh my most beloved one in my Divine Presence, don't worry and don't fear because I am with you and your religion shall cover the whole world. Even if it be for just one day I shall make the whole world accept Islam and to surrender to Me and to declare your prophecy".

    I am however sorry to say that today the Muslims have been cheated by the Christians and they are now following the Christian world. They are now not using Islamic principles and are instead hurrying to become westernized Muslims. There cannot be westernized Muslims. Muslims are purely Muslims and they have principles, and these are the principles of Islam. Those who use these principles have been granted honour through this life and through their physical beings. They have also being granted spiritual powers. Yes, we also have spiritual power and when Jesus returns he is going to declare this power and to blame the Christians. May Allah forgive us and bless you for the honour of the most honoured one in His Divine Presence. Oh Allah, You know. Fathiha.


    Mawlana shaykh Nazim Al Haqqani RadiAllahu Anh met the pope after the pope apologised and wanted to meet shaykh Nazim .

    shaykh Nazim said to his close khadim nabeel

    “ I have a good feeling this man will come to Islam and he will leave his post “

    what happened, there was public meeting and a private , the public was the one you saw where they met outside the church but there was also a private meeting in lefkosher where the pope and Shaykh Nazim Al Haqqani And brother nabeel Alayhi Rahmah had met . Nabeel told many of the close mureeds he bore witness the pope taking shahada in front of shaykh Nazim Al Haqqani RadiAllahu Anh.

    Shaykh Nazim went on to say after the meeting , when I hugged him , I took all his burdens away from his shoulders, this pope wants to be free of this . “

    This matter is left to Allah and his Prophet SalAllahu Alayhi Wasalam
  20. MaturidiNahwi

    MaturidiNahwi New Member

    By the way, my point is not to talk about what Shaykh Nazim died upon. I'm not doing takfir of him or saying what aqeedah and what state he died upon. My objective here is to point out deviances that non-stop get promoted/defended by people like you, and endanger one's imaan.
    My objective is not to do takfir of Shaykh Hisham, Shaykh Lokman, Shaykh Gibril Fouad Haddad or the other people answering questions on eshaykh. However, my objective is to point out any deviances and to make a point that these deviances are getting accepted by followers and the imaan of followers is being endangered.
    You constantly point out that you don't accept the answers of eshaykh's deviated, kufr-promoting and kufr-hinting answers. But you're missing part of the point - that people ARE accepting these answers and they ARE jeopardising their imaan.
    You constantly point out that they talk against wahhabism and deobandism. But you're not getting the point - those aren't the only 2 fitan in the world right now. There are other fitan too, such as perennialism, which seems to be prevalent amongst SOME haqqanis (before I'm accused of making an attack on every member of that tariqah).

    Take a look at this video for instance. He is very harsh against najdis, but at the same time he shows clear ignorance of aqeedah at around 4:45 to 5:15...
    He sounds like a najdi himself, saying 'one breath that He breathed into Adam'...
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